- dfdl-wg - lists.ogf.org

DFDL call tomorrow 9am PST
by Westhead, Martin (Martin) 02 May '07

02 May '07

Sorry, I am on a training course tomorrow and will not be able to make it... PASSCODE INFORMATION: Passcode: 1397733 ACCESS NUMBERS ------------------------------------ Click http://www.mymeetings.com/audioconferencing/globalAccessFAQ.php for information on specific country access dialing. Country Toll Numbers Freephone/Toll Free Number AUSTRIA 43-1-92-86-505 BELGIUM 32-1-150-0313 DENMARK 45-7014-0241 FRANCE PARIS: 33-1-70-75-25-34 080-563-9912 GERMANY 49-69-2222-20597 0800-101-6628 IRELAND 353-1-247-5273 ITALY 39-02-3601-0918 LUXEMBOURG 352-27-000-1319 NETHERLANDS 31-20-718-8531 SPAIN 34-91-414-63-07 800-098-195 SWEDEN 46-8-505-78-547 SWITZERLAND 41-44-580-4388 0800-001-371 UNITED KINGDOM LONDON: 44-20-7019-0801 0800-279-9191 USA 866-253-5305 Restrictions may exist when accessing freephone/toll free numbers using a mobile telephone. Country Freephone numbers cannot be used outside of the country listed. Please provide an International Country toll number to your participants as a back-up in the event of any Freephone restrictions being encountered. To learn more about how to dial a Global Access number go to https://www.mymeetings.com/audioconferencing/global_access.php Dr. Martin Westhead Technical Lead, Assured Networks Group, Milpitas, CA| westhead(a)avaya.com |+1 408-577-7810 AVAYA

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review items on draft v017
by Mike Beckerle 25 Apr '07

25 Apr '07

This is section by section review I've receieved about version 017 from Steve, Geoff and Alan Powell (IBM), concentrating on the semantics sections (11, 12, 18). 10.1. Table missing simple type definition. (Also, complex type should be "definition" not "declaration" in schema speak). 11.4. Confusion around the description of the Root Value Approximation. Not 100% clear what this is trying to convey. Can it be described as being the equivalent of a DOM tree, built up as we parse our way through the bits? Also, could the description be moved into its own 11.x section? 11.4.2. Question the use of "memory" as the name for the variables tuple values - sounded too implementation like. 11.4.2. Why is it necessary to return memory as an output value and pass the memory separately from the context? Put another way, can we treat variables the same as other properties? 11.4.3.1. content length - should be end minus start 11.4.3.1. Does the last sentence just mean to refer to non-dimensioned, non-optional elements? 11.4.3.2. "Dynamic extent" & "dynamic scope" - names not intuitive - should "representation" be in their somewhere? Also "scope" being re-used ? 12. Format nit: Numbered lists not resetting. 12.3. Ruling out recursion for DFDL v1.0 is probably ok 12.4.1. Needs to handle the case where a sequence/choice is embedded in another sequence/choice. Terminology assumes that FIRST, MIDDLE, LAST are elements. 12.4.1. General point: Needs re-inforcing that the content related operations (FIRST, MIDDLE, LAST, CONTENT) involve recursive calls to P (specifically one of E, C, G, R). 12.4.2. To be capable of use on a complex type's sequence or on an embedded sequence, your source to source transform actually replaces an unordered sequence with an ordered sequence, which contains an array element of local complex type, whose content is a choice... 12.4.2. "The dfdl:unordered is dropped" ... add "from the transformed sequence, other DFDL properties are unchanged". 12.4.2. The key sentence in this is "Ordered and unordered are characteristics of the representation only". This needs to be right up front. 12.4.2. Concern that implementing our own interpretation of unordered as described may be seen by wider community as clashing with xsd:all (which has been relaxed in XSD 1.1), does not allow a user to preserve his bitstream order (which although random could still have a semantic), and does not allow us to output exactly what we parsed. 12.4.2. General point: Output matching model order. Needs discussion. If we consider schema validation as separate from DFDL parse/unparse, then shouldn't the DFDL unparser output what it is presented with? 12.5. First mention of ATTEMPT. Did you mean EXISTS? 12.6. Why is it necessary to pull EXISTS into the array parser? You don't do the same for the sequence parser. 12.6. Is a NONE function also needed for sequence? If not can you say why. 12.6. Example call sequence - SEP missing between MIDDLE and EXISTS. 12.7. Is E missing from the first sentence? 12.8. Update to handle embedded sequences/choices. 12.8.1. Format nit: First line - blank space after dfdl:choice. 12.8.1. PRE and POST are handled in MRM today with choices. 12.8.2. Unrelated to main review: dfdl:lengthKind="xpath" .... is a better enum for this "pathExpression" 12.9.1. xsd:any can take minOccurs and maxOccurs, and default to (1,1). I think you've assumed that it is (0, unbounded). I think we need to decide if we support repeating wildcards. If we don't then the source transform of xsd:any for strict is direct to xsd:choice and for lax is direct to the xsd:sequence (you don't need the dummy complex type. In both cases you don't need the extra element, nor therefore the "id" attribute. 12.11.2.2. Would the complexType be better called bytesToBinaryInteger to match the output repType? 18.1.2. Why is localTerminator a separate argument, isn't everything you need in the context? 18.1.3. Contradicts itself about use of escape schemes. 18.2. Might not be understanding this. The magic 8 and 16 seem to be supplying defaults - but we don't allow property defaults. 18.2. binaryPrefixedString, binaryFixedString: DFDL allows lengthUnits to be 'bytes' for fixed length strings and prefixed strings. 18.2. binaryPrefixedString: LEN calculation omits some of the required properties 18.2. Not clear what the schema fragment is illustrating, nor the following P() function and two return statements. 18.4. Can AP and LSB never be set from variables ? They don't take them as input. 18.4.2. We are not convinced that using the bootstrapping technique of defining DFDL behaviour in terms of itself always helps. AP is a good example of things appearing to get overly complicated. It might be preferable to use some other code or pseudo-code mechanism to specify these behaviours - like you have in 18.4.3.

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New internal draft of Core document
by Mike Beckerle 25 Apr '07

25 Apr '07

I've posted version 017 of the internal draft core spec. to the gridforge site. Here is the URL: https://forge.gridforum.org/sf/docman/do/viewDocument/projects.dfdl-wg/docm… I'd like to ask people to review it with an eye towards whether the semantics part is clear enough or at least getting there. The major accomplishment in this draft was folding together some of Geoff's material on defaults/nulls/missing/optional (especially the input flow-charts) into the parse-strategies technique so as to illustrate that the parse-strategies framework I had put in was capable of handling this complexity. This spec is really now getting to the limit of what I can do in MS-Word. I.e., there's too much stuff in here that really needs to be developed as code in a programming language to insure there are no errors in it. Assuming the semantics framework is now ok, the next work is really cranking out actual parse and length strategy and conversion definitions, and this is going to be very error prone unless done in some type-checked and executable form. ...mikeb Mike Beckerle STSM, Architect, Scalable Computing IBM Software Group Information Platform and Solutions Westborough, MA 01581 direct: voice and FAX 508-599-7148 assistant: Pam Riordan priordan(a)us.ibm.com 508-599-7046

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DFDL call Wed 9am PST
by Westhead, Martin (Martin) 25 Apr '07

25 Apr '07

The agenda will be focused on the ongoing changes to the document for OGF in May. Martin Call details: The following number can be used for our future regular weekly 12pm US.ET (9am US.PT) calls. This number does not require activation by a confidential leader code; hence, no matter who dials in first, the call will be active and people can get started. The call is active from 12pm to 1:30pm US.ET. I believe this will change with the US time zones in the fall, but we'll find out when we get there. If we schedule other calls at other times we'll need to use different dial-in numbers of course. *Dial-in Number: 8777602813 *Dial-in Toll Number: 7706595626 *Conference Code: 95697 Helpful Keypad Commands: * *0 Operator Assistance - conference * 00 Operator Assistance - individual * *6 / #6 Mute/Unmute - individual Dr. Martin Westhead Technical Lead, Assured Networks Group, Milpitas, CA| westhead(a)avaya.com |+1 408-577-7810 AVAYA

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DFDL call NOW - note the number
by Westhead, Martin (Martin) 18 Apr '07

18 Apr '07

PASSCODE INFORMATION: Passcode: 1397733 ACCESS NUMBERS ------------------------------------ Click http://www.mymeetings.com/audioconferencing/globalAccessFAQ.php for information on specific country access dialing. Country Toll Numbers Freephone/Toll Free Number AUSTRIA 43-1-92-86-505 BELGIUM 32-1-150-0313 DENMARK 45-7014-0241 FRANCE PARIS: 33-1-70-75-25-34 080-563-9912 GERMANY 49-69-2222-20597 0800-101-6628 IRELAND 353-1-247-5273 ITALY 39-02-3601-0918 LUXEMBOURG 352-27-000-1319 NETHERLANDS 31-20-718-8531 SPAIN 34-91-414-63-07 800-098-195 SWEDEN 46-8-505-78-547 SWITZERLAND 41-44-580-4388 0800-001-371 UNITED KINGDOM LONDON: 44-20-7019-0801 0800-279-9191 USA 866-253-5305 Restrictions may exist when accessing freephone/toll free numbers using a mobile telephone. Country Freephone numbers cannot be used outside of the country listed. Please provide an International Country toll number to your participants as a back-up in the event of any Freephone restrictions being encountered. To learn more about how to dial a Global Access number go to https://www.mymeetings.com/audioconferencing/global_access.php Dr. Martin Westhead Technical Lead, Assured Networks Group, Milpitas, CA| westhead(a)avaya.com |+1 408-577-7810 AVAYA

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New Conference Call number
by Mike Beckerle 11 Apr '07

11 Apr '07

The following number can be used for our future regular weekly 12pm US.ET (9am US.PT) calls. This number does not require activation by a confidential leader code; hence, no matter who dials in first, the call will be active and people can get started. The call is active from 12pm to 1:30pm US.ET. I believe this will change with the US time zones in the fall, but we'll find out when we get there. If we schedule other calls at other times we'll need to use different dial-in numbers of course. *Dial-in Number: 8777602813 *Dial-in Toll Number: 7706595626 *Conference Code: 95697 Helpful Keypad Commands: *0 Operator Assistance - conference 00 Operator Assistance - individual *6 / #6 Mute/Unmute - individual

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DFDL session at OGF 20 - confirmed
by Steve Hanson 03 Apr '07

03 Apr '07

The session has been confirmed, it will be on 8th May at 11am. See here for full schedule: http://www.ogf.org/gf/session_request/index.php?browse&order=12 Regards, Steve Steve Hanson WebSphere Message Brokers Hursley, UK Internet: smh(a)uk.ibm.com Phone (+44)/(0) 1962-815848 Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU

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can someone draft this?
by Mike Beckerle 28 Mar '07

28 Mar '07

I've been working on the DFDL spec quite a bit. Steve Hanson suggested that this woudl be good to have in the document before the April OGF. 5. What is DFDL, including a sub-section giving scope of DFDL 1.0. Right now the doc has this content which is pretty much entirely TBD/placeholder. Can someone step up to the plate to revise this? I am working on other aspects than this, i.e., trying to reorganize and straighten out the decomposition of the semantics into the parse function and parse strategies. I really want to focus on this aspect, but I agree with steve that thsi woudl be great to have done in time. ----------------------------------- What is DFDL Version 1.0? Version 1.0 of DFDL is a language capable of expressing a wide array of binary and text-based data formats. DFDL is capable of describing binary data as found in the data structures of Cobol, C, PL1, Fortran, etc. In particular, it is able to describe repeating sub-arrays where the length of an array is stored in another location of the structure. TBD.... DFDL is capable of describing a wide variety of textual data formats. These include TBD:list of examples. TBD: mixtures. Composition properties. I.e., two formats can be nested, concatenated, etc. to create a new working format definition. (limitations here due to regexp?) The following topics have been deferred to future versions of the standard: Extensibility: There are real examples of proprietary data format description languages that we use as our base of experience from which to derive standard DFDL. However, there are no examples of extensible format description languages; hence, while extensibility is desirable in DFDL, there is not yet a base of experience with extensibility from which to derive a standard. Layering: Some formats require data to be described in multiple layers. That is, where one element's contents becomes the representation of another element. DFDL V1.0 allows description of only one layer.

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FYI: dfdl.com now available. Pricey. Grrrr.
by Mike Beckerle 27 Mar '07

27 Mar '07

Wow, we are famous. A domain name that costs real money! :-) The domain name dfdl.com is for sale Prices in the region of US$4250 Get On The Web Limited registered for its own websites, portals and client projects a number of generic domain names (including this one) some years ago, which are now no longer required. We are considering selling this domain name alone, or the domain name plus partially-developed website. If you are interested in this domain name please complete this offer form.

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DFDL call tomorrow - note new number/time
by Westhead, Martin (Martin) 27 Mar '07

27 Mar '07

Hi Folks, Please find below details of the DFDL dial-in. We are back to our regular slot of 1700 BST, 0900 PDT. The agenda will be to continue last week's discussion around the document changes that Mike implemented. I will have to drop after the first half hour for another call. Martin The dial-in details for tomorrow's DFDL call is show below. The UK clocks went to BST last weekend. Thus the call time will be (17:00 BST, 09:00 Pacific Daylight Savings Time) PASSCODE INFORMATION: Passcode: 1397733 ACCESS NUMBERS ------------------------------------ Click http://www.mymeetings.com/audioconferencing/globalAccessFAQ.php for information on specific country access dialing. Country Toll Numbers Freephone/Toll Free Number AUSTRIA 43-1-92-86-505 BELGIUM 32-1-150-0313 DENMARK 45-7014-0241 FRANCE PARIS: 33-1-70-75-25-34 080-563-9912 GERMANY 49-69-2222-20597 0800-101-6628 IRELAND 353-1-247-5273 ITALY 39-02-3601-0918 LUXEMBOURG 352-27-000-1319 NETHERLANDS 31-20-718-8531 SPAIN 34-91-414-63-07 800-098-195 SWEDEN 46-8-505-78-547 SWITZERLAND 41-44-580-4388 0800-001-371 UNITED KINGDOM LONDON: 44-20-7019-0801 0800-279-9191 USA 866-253-5305 Restrictions may exist when accessing freephone/toll free numbers using a mobile telephone. Country Freephone numbers cannot be used outside of the country listed. Please provide an International Country toll number to your participants as a back-up in the event of any Freephone restrictions being encountered. To learn more about how to dial a Global Access number go to https://www.mymeetings.com/audioconferencing/global_access.php Regards, Geoff Judd WebSphere Message Brokers Development IBM United Kingdom Ltd. Hursley Telephone: +44-1962-818461 E-mail: JUDDG(a)uk.ibm.com _____ Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU Dr. Martin Westhead Technical Lead, Assured Networks Group, Milpitas, CA| westhead(a)avaya.com |+1 408-577-7810 AVAYA

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