- cypherpunks-legacy@lists.ogf.org

Hasty analogy (WAS: Viral encryption)
by fergp＠sytex.com 12 Feb '93

12 Feb '93

On Friday, 12 Feb 1993, Phiber Optik <uunet!eff.org!phiber> wrote - PO> I'm sick and tired of all the virus hoo-hah myself. PO> The only "anti-virus software" a hacker needs is DEBUG. PO> And maybe your favorite sector editor utility, like DISKEDIT. PO> Anything more, and you're an embarassment. Why don't you just PO> send your life savings to McAfee while you're at it. I could PO> go and quote P. T. Barnum right now, but I think my point is PO> made. My apologies for strayiing even further from the topic, but Phyber's comments would not let me let this sleeping dog lie. Strictly using DEBUG is a bit ridiculous for the "masses", but I can understand your sentiment, at least to that end. As far as I'm concerned, I can isolate _any_ change in my operating environment (be it DOS, Novell NOS, UNIX or whatever, for that matter) with the utilities that accompany the operating system (and of course, a couple of home-brewed ones to boot). Viruses are simply nuisances, for those who are adept enough to bop around in assembly code. Your disdain for "anti-virus software" is shared by many -- even shared by myself, to a certain degree. Every time I read an advertisement in a trade rag that boasts, "Can now find and eradicate new and unknown viruses!" or "Now! Can kill the deadly Mutation Engine virus!", I can only shake my head and snicker. However, there are a couple of genuine "good guys" out there in computer land that produces some excellent "anti-virus" software. Dr. Alan Solomon (UK) and Fridrik Skulason (Iceland), both of whom I know personally, produce perhaps the most effective and timely virus detection software in the business. Yes, they both will tell you that they use DEBUG to trace code and disassemble. Sara told me that you were rather impetuous. ;-) Further discussions relating to thhis topic should be moved to comp.virus (virus-l(a)lehigh.edu) or directed to me by email. Paul Ferguson | "Sincerity is fine, but it's no Network Integration Consultant | excuse for stupidity." Alexandria, Virginia USA | -- Anonymous fergp(a)sytex.com (Internet) | sytex.com!fergp (UUNet) | 1:109/229 (FidoNet) | PGP public encryption key available upon request. --- fergp(a)sytex.com (Paul Ferguson) Sytex Systems Communications, Arlington VA, 1-703-358-9022

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White House email address (fwd)
by Barry.Kapke＠f33.n125.z1.FIDONET.ORG 12 Feb '93

12 Feb '93

============================================================================= From: DOUGLAS COFFMAN <lefty%MTU.EDU(a)Kentvm.Kent.edu> Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1993 18:01:53 EDT ----------------------------Original message---------------------------- Please pass this info along. January 31, 1993 Important Information RE: E-Mail to the White House Yesterday, I saw several postings related to the E-mail address for the White House. Along with a good number of others, I worked throughout the campaign as part of a network of E-mail volunteers for the Clinton campaign, so I can pass along some important information about that E-mail account. The account is actually the personal compuserve account of Jock Gill. Jock worked hard (along with a handful of programming volunteers, BBS operators, listserver maintainers, and computer sophisticates at places such as Marist College, MIT, San Francisco, Chicago, and elsewhere) during the campaign to put together an E-mail system for national campaigning. The system was later expanded to accommodate all three major Presidential campaigns. It was an innovative, highly successful effort and it played a huge role in getting campaign position statements out to a wide public. Things posted from that address found their way into the virtual reality as the messages got passed along many networks from their original posting. Several weeks before the Inauguration of President Clinton, Jeff Eller was appointed by the President-Elect to have overall charge of establishing something which has never existed--an interactive public access E-mail system into the White House and into other offices of the administration. Jock Gill was then hired by the administration to work under Jeff Eller. Currently, Jock Gill is working in an office located in the Old Executive Office Building across the street from the White House. At this point, he is working alone, without a staff. His current assignment is to use the E-mail system (as during the campaign) to issue official copies of White House statements, the texts of press briefings and press conferences, copies of Executive Orders and Presidential Memos, and the like to the virtual world of E-mail. Since the compuserve box is a regular personal mail box, it gets filled quickly, especially given the high volume of mail now beginning to arrive with the broad dissemination of his address. Those of you who have sent E-mail to that address may well have received an error message stating that the box is full. That's another way of saying it has been overwhelmed. Jock has asked those of us who have been part of the volunteer E-mail team to help him out while he works to get a good interactive system up and running. Basically, he has asked that everyone cooperate and not begin sending a barrage of E-mail to that compuserve address. The White House itself employs a large staff to handle snail mail. Actually, at this point in the development of the White House E-mail system, you will probably get your message through to the administration quicker through ordinary snail mail and telephone. Later, once the administration's E-mail team develops the system they want and need, E-mail contacts should became the easier route. All things in their time. Once the E-mail address was circulated together with the heading the "White House", everyone understandably believed a real system was up and running. Not quite yet. SUGGESTION: Use the compuserve address you have judiciously, reserving it for absolutely vital contacts. Until such time that a real public access White house E-mail system is operational, consider relying on the traditional means of contacting the administration. Given what they had to start with from the previous administration (scratch), I have every reason to expect that Jeff Eller and Jock Gill will work well--and as quickly as possible--to get an interactive system up and running. But it will take time and patience. We can all help them achieve that effort best if we refrain from acting as if that non-existent system were already in place. PLEASE HELP RELAY THIS CONTEXT AND SUGGESTION TO OTHER NETWORKS AND INDIVIDUALS. Thanks. Snail Mail Address and Phone Numbers -- White House White House Numbers: The President (202) 456-1414 White House Comment Line (202) 456-1111 (To register your opinion on an issue) When bill signed or vetoed (202) 456-2226 Vice President (202) 456-2326 (202) 456-7125 Mailing Address: The White House 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, N.W. Washington DC 20500 -- On the Net, Douglas J. "Lefty" Coffman lefty(a)mtu.edu (Preferred) LEFTY(a)MTUS5.BITNET or LEFTY(a)MTUS5.cts.mtu.edu B0 f- w+ g++ k(+) s h r =============================================================================-- Barry Kapke - via FidoNet node 1:125/555 UUCP - ...!uunet!hoptoad!kumr!fidogate!33!Barry.Kapke INTERNET - Barry.Kapke(a)f33.n125.z1.FIDONET.ORG

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E pluribus doodah
by M..Stirner＠f28.n125.z1.FIDONET.ORG 12 Feb '93

12 Feb '93

from: john.nieder(a)f33.n125.z1.fidonet.org * Reply to msg originally in Cypherpunks BK> Currently, Jock Gill is BK> working in an office located in the Old Executive Office Building BK> across the street from the White House. At this point, he is BK> working alone, without a staff. This week's news indicates to me this will probably not improve. BK> The White House itself employs a large BK> staff to handle snail mail. According to Monday night's news, this is from where these vaunted "symbolic" 25% White House staff cuts will come. BK> All things in their time. Once the BK> E-mail address was circulated together with the heading the "White BK> House", everyone understandably believed a real system was up and BK> running. Yes, silly us...particularly with the "CLINTON" AOL address. BK> SUGGESTION: Use the compuserve address you have judiciously, BK> reserving it for absolutely vital contacts. Oh, yes, _certainly_! The _vital_ stuff should go into a nonexistant system. Naturally! BK> Until such time that a BK> real public access White house E-mail system is operational, BK> consider relying on the traditional means of contacting the BK> administration. Given what they had to start with from the BK> previous administration (scratch), I have every reason to expect BK> that Jeff Eller and Jock Gill will work well--and as quickly as BK> possible--to get an interactive system up and running. But it will BK> take time and patience. Can anyone say, "VAPORWARE"? BK> We can all help them achieve that effort BK> best if we refrain from acting as if that non-existent system were BK> already in place. PLEASE HELP RELAY THIS CONTEXT AND SUGGESTION TO BK> OTHER NETWORKS AND INDIVIDUALS. Thanks. Pass it around? You bet. It's f*cking _hilarious_! My guess is that this gaffe will (or at least ought to) get Gill fired, assuming he survives this "symbolic" staff downsizing. I might add that nothing could be more "symbolic" than the announcement that the cuts will come from those who actually respond to public input. This "go away & don't bother us" move on the part of the Clinton administration indicates that it obviously doesn't care _what_ America thinks. . There is a _bright side_ to this, however: Would such an indifferent administration spend resources trying to break our codes when it doesn't care what we have to say anyway? 8-) JN ... We want information./You won't get it!/By hook or by crook, we _will_! ... Forgive your enemies but remember their names. ___ Blue Wave/QWK v2.12 -- M. Stirner - via FidoNet node 1:125/555 UUCP - ...!uunet!hoptoad!kumr!fidogate!28!M..Stirner INTERNET - M..Stirner(a)f28.n125.z1.FIDONET.ORG

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Re: wired & batch file
by tcmay＠netcom.com 12 Feb '93

12 Feb '93

Karl Barrus writes: > Finally, crypto is mentioned in WIRED magazine! It's on the >"HYPE LIST" behind Object Oriented, Post-Modern, Raves, and ahead of >Smart Drugs. Here is the paragraph on it (bottom of page 87): And I'm sure you all know "Wired" is preparing a major article on the Cypherpunks and crypto. I've seen the Steven Levy rough draft and it looks good. >So, fellow rabid defenders freedom, who is Ted Nelson?? :-) I guess >I'm too young... You _must_ be young! Lucky you. Ted Nelson is the chief popularizer (and early architect, to be fair) of "hypertext," or nonlinear, linked writing. As in being able to click on this word, "hypertext," and see lots of threads taking you off to various other places, articles, sidebars, and so on. Hypertexts thus transcend the simple linear writing style enforced on us by paper and books. Nelson wrote an extremely influential book called "Computer Lib," circa 1975, which described hypertext and accurately predicted many of today's most important trends. Microsoft Press reprinted it, with corrections and addditions, a few years back. Definitely recommended! His project, known as "Xanadu," has been developing for close to 30 years. About 10 or so years a team of programmers nucleated around Xanadu to commercialize it. Known as the Xanadu Operating Company, it was funded by Autodesk (maker of Autocad) from 1988 until just a few months ago, when Autodesk decided to reorient its efforts. XOC may still be seeking alternative funding. Our own Dean Tribble is centrally involved, and other participants included Mark Miller, Roger Gregory, and various others (some of whom show up on this list, or at the physical Cypherpunks meetings). Apple's "HyperCard" was a poor imitation, in the sense that full bidirectional links were not supported (and some other limitations, though in fairness to Bill Atkinson and Apple, the original product, codenamed "WildCard," was not intended to be full hypertext.) (I use a true hypertext writing system called "StorySpace," for the Mac. Other platforms have their own such programs. Nothing as grand as Xanadu, though. And there's a newsgroup called alt.hypertext if you're interested.) Ted Nelson is living in the Bay Area, working on various projects. He's shown some interest in crypto things, and talked to some of us at a recent Hackers Conference about the implications. Hypertext is definitely a good idea, but the commercialization has been slow in coming. -Tim May > >/-----------------------------------\ >| Karl L. Barrus | >| elee9sf(a)menudo.uh.edu | <- preferred address >| barrus(a)tree.egr.uh.edu (NeXTMail) | >\-----------------------------------/

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Re: wired & batch file
by tcmay＠netcom.com 12 Feb '93

12 Feb '93

Karl Barrus writes: > Finally, crypto is mentioned in WIRED magazine! It's on the >"HYPE LIST" behind Object Oriented, Post-Modern, Raves, and ahead of >Smart Drugs. Here is the paragraph on it (bottom of page 87): And I'm sure you all know "Wired" is preparing a major article on the Cypherpunks and crypto. I've seen the Steven Levy rough draft and it looks good. >So, fellow rabid defenders freedom, who is Ted Nelson?? :-) I guess >I'm too young... You _must_ be young! Lucky you. Ted Nelson is the chief popularizer (and early architect, to be fair) of "hypertext," or nonlinear, linked writing. As in being able to click on this word, "hypertext," and see lots of threads taking you off to various other places, articles, sidebars, and so on. Hypertexts thus transcend the simple linear writing style enforced on us by paper and books. Nelson wrote an extremely influential book called "Computer Lib," circa 1975, which described hypertext and accurately predicted many of today's most important trends. Microsoft Press reprinted it, with corrections and addditions, a few years back. Definitely recommended! His project, known as "Xanadu," has been developing for close to 30 years. About 10 or so years a team of programmers nucleated around Xanadu to commercialize it. Known as the Xanadu Operating Company, it was funded by Autodesk (maker of Autocad) from 1988 until just a few months ago, when Autodesk decided to reorient its efforts. XOC may still be seeking alternative funding. Our own Dean Tribble is centrally involved, and other participants included Mark Miller, Roger Gregory, and various others (some of whom show up on this list, or at the physical Cypherpunks meetings). Apple's "HyperCard" was a poor imitation, in the sense that full bidirectional links were not supported (and some other limitations, though in fairness to Bill Atkinson and Apple, the original product, codenamed "WildCard," was not intended to be full hypertext.) (I use a true hypertext writing system called "StorySpace," for the Mac. Other platforms have their own such programs. Nothing as grand as Xanadu, though. And there's a newsgroup called alt.hypertext if you're interested.) Ted Nelson is living in the Bay Area, working on various projects. He's shown some interest in crypto things, and talked to some of us at a recent Hackers Conference about the implications. Hypertext is definitely a good idea, but the commercialization has been slow in coming. -Tim May > >/-----------------------------------\ >| Karl L. Barrus | >| elee9sf(a)menudo.uh.edu | <- preferred address >| barrus(a)tree.egr.uh.edu (NeXTMail) | >\-----------------------------------/

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Re: Compressed/Encrypted Voice using Modems
by Phil Karn 12 Feb '93

12 Feb '93

At 11:41 2/10/93 -0500, Murdering Thug wrote: >The best solution, as suggested by Miron is to use forward error correction. >There is plenty of bandwidth in a 19.2/21.6/24.0/28.8 kbps connection to >send CELP nybbles or bytes each along with their own ECC code. But modern high speed modems already do quite a bit of FEC. I really don't think more is really necessary. As long as the decryptor and voice decoder automatically resynchronize after an error, there's no real problem with letting a few through. It's certainly preferable to adding long (or variable) delay. The sychronization problem seems to occur in "real" (government) secure phones too. They take a second or two to unmute following loss of clock synchronization. But not every bit error causes loss of clock synch; only a really bad line will do that. Phil

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wired & batch file
by Karl Barrus 12 Feb '93

12 Feb '93

Cypherpunks, Douglas Sinclair has notified me of a slight bug/irritation with the anonmail.bat script for MSDOS. When run with no parameters, file errors are reported since the batch file attempts to delete nonexistent files. So I fixed that and have submitted the revised version to the ftp site. Also, in unix I can redirect stderr to /dev/null ( 2> /dev/null). Is there a way to do this in MSDOS (I can't seem to find a way). This would make the hopmail.bat batch file (similar to hop.mail) easier to use since the PGP output will be suppressed. Finally, crypto is mentioned in WIRED magazine! It's on the "HYPE LIST" behind Object Oriented, Post-Modern, Raves, and ahead of Smart Drugs. Here is the paragraph on it (bottom of page 87): Forty years ago cryptography wasn't even popular with mathematicians. Now it's the hot topic on the net. You've got the export issue, always popular since it the [sic] NSA is the villain. There's the public key issue - RSA Inc. expressing concern over the public good, not their profit margins. Yeah right. Now we have the key-registration debate: Should PKC users have to register their keys? OK, it's a bad idea, but probably a government conspiracy to eliminate cash, as some rabid defenders of freedom are claiming. Then there's David Chaum, the Ted Nelson of the 90's, promoting his ingenious and impractical crypto-schemes. Since everyone wants to believe in nice techno solutions to messy socio-policital problems, expect this issue to continue its rise up the list. So, fellow rabid defenders freedom, who is Ted Nelson?? :-) I guess I'm too young... /-----------------------------------\ | Karl L. Barrus | | elee9sf(a)menudo.uh.edu | <- preferred address | barrus(a)tree.egr.uh.edu (NeXTMail) | \-----------------------------------/

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pardon me, but it's been deathly quiet
by richard_mezirka＠askinc.ask.com 11 Feb '93

11 Feb '93

regrets about the perhaps poor use of scarce bandwidth: sci.crypt has disappeared from my news server I haven't seen a cypherpunks mail item for some time... I used to see something daily, some very interesting/some just valuable to me for awareness raising value is anyone there or did all the things we're concerned about come true? Rich

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Re: E Plurbis Doodah
by pete＠cirrus.com 11 Feb '93

11 Feb '93

> from: john.nieder(a)f33.n125.z1.fidonet.org > > There is a _bright side_ to this, however: Would such an > indifferent administration spend resources trying to break our codes > when it doesn't care what we have to say anyway? 8-) > JN Ah, if only it were so... Apparently you haven't heard about the new nomination for attorney general. A prosecutor from Florida with a "get-tough" reputation. Undoubtedly an anti-drug warrior. And since "everyone knows" that the only reason to hide information from our "great benevolent government" is to "cover-up illegal activites", I'm not quite so hopeful. "Don't blame me, I voted Libertarian" Pete Carpenter pete(a)cirrus.com Talk about your plenty, talk about your ills, One man gathers what another man spills. - Robert Hunter

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E PLURIBUS DOODAH
by John.Nieder＠f33.n125.z1.FIDONET.ORG 11 Feb '93

11 Feb '93

from: john.nieder(a)f33.n125.z1.fidonet.org * Reply to msg originally in Cypherpunks BK> Currently, Jock Gill is BK> working in an office located in the Old Executive Office Building BK> across the street from the White House. At this point, he is BK> working alone, without a staff. This week's news indicates to me this will probably not improve. BK> The White House itself employs a large BK> staff to handle snail mail. According to Monday night's news, this is from where these vaunted "symbolic" 25% White House staff cuts will come. BK> All things in their time. Once the BK> E-mail address was circulated together with the heading the "White BK> House", everyone understandably believed a real system was up and BK> running. Yes, silly us...to say nothing of the "CLINTON" AOL address BK> SUGGESTION: Use the compuserve address you have judiciously, BK> reserving it for absolutely vital contacts. Oh, yes, _certainly_! The _vital_ stuff should go into a nonexistant system. Naturally! BK> Until such time that a BK> real public access White house E-mail system is operational, BK> consider relying on the traditional means of contacting the BK> administration. Given what they had to start with from the BK> previous administration (scratch), I have every reason to expect BK> that Jeff Eller and Jock Gill will work well--and as quickly as BK> possible--to get an interactive system up and running. But it will BK> take time and patience. Can anyone say, "VAPORWARE"? BK> We can all help them achieve that effort BK> best if we refrain from acting as if that non-existent system were BK> already in place. PLEASE HELP RELAY THIS CONTEXT AND SUGGESTION TO BK> OTHER NETWORKS AND INDIVIDUALS. Thanks. Pass it around? You bet. It's f*cking _hilarious_! My guess is that this gaffe will (or at least ought to) get Gill fired, assuming he survives this "symbolic" staff downsizing. I might add that nothing could be more "symbolic" than the announcement that the cuts will come from those who actually respond to public input. This "go away & don't bother us" move on the part of the Clinton administration indicates that it obviously doesn't care _what_ America thinks. . There is a _bright side_ to this, however: Would such an indifferent administration spend resources trying to break our codes when it doesn't care what we have to say anyway? 8-) JN ... We want information./You won't get it!/By hook or by crook, we _will_! -- John Nieder - via FidoNet node 1:125/555 UUCP - ...!uunet!hoptoad!kumr!fidogate!33!John.Nieder INTERNET - John.Nieder(a)f33.n125.z1.FIDONET.ORG

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