May 2009 - pgi-wg - lists.ogf.org

Re: [Pgi-wg] Promised document
by Steve Crouch 20 May '09

20 May '09

Hi, OMII-UK's intent is to support this within GridSAM. As of today, we haven't commissioned anybody or committed our own effort, but we're currently looking into ways we could support this work. Cheers Steve Crouch -- Dr Stephen Crouch, Software Architect, OMII-UK, Electronics and Computer Science, Room 4067, Level 4, Building 32, University of Southampton, Highfield, Southampton SO17 1BJ Tel: +44 (0)23 8059 8787 EMail: s.crouch(a)omii.ac.uk Fax: +44 (0)23 8059 3045 WWW: http://www.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~stc Morris Riedel wrote: > ..as part of Grid-SAM? > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > Morris Riedel > SW - Engineer > Distributed Systems and Grid Computing Division > Jülich Supercomputing Centre (JSC) > Forschungszentrum Juelich > Wilhelm-Johnen-Str. 1 > D - 52425 Juelich > Germany > > Email: m.riedel(a)fz-juelich.de > Info: http://www.fz-juelich.de/jsc/JSCPeople/riedel > Phone: +49 2461 61 - 3651 > Fax: +49 2461 61 - 6656 > > Skype: MorrisRiedel > > "We work to better ourselves, and the rest of humanity" > > Sitz der Gesellschaft: Jülich > Eingetragen im Handelsregister des Amtsgerichts Düren Nr. HR B 3498 > Vorsitzende des Aufsichtsrats: MinDirig'in Bärbel Brumme-Bothe > Vorstand: Prof. Dr. Achim Bachem (Vorsitzender), > Dr. Ulrich Krafft (stellv. Vorsitzender) > > >> ------Original Message----- >> -From: David Wallom [mailto:david.wallom@oerc.ox.ac.uk] >> -Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 3:38 PM >> -To: Morris Riedel; 'Moreno Marzolla' >> -Cc: Steven Newhouse; pgi-wg(a)ogf.org >> -Subject: Re: [Pgi-wg] Promised document >> - >> -It is being implemented by OMII-UK >> - >> -David >> - >> - >> -On 20/05/2009 12:30, "Morris Riedel" <m.riedel(a)fz-juelich.de> wrote: >> - >> -> Hi team, >> -> >> ->> - David suggested to check the "JSDL parameter sweep >> ->> -extension" draft as it could allow describing a set of arbitrarily >> ->> -different jobs (for the requirement of bulk job submission to the >> ->> -execution service, which is a feature currently not supported). >> -> >> -> FYI: I did an excerpt of this standard yesterday, I put it on gridforge > for >> -> those that seek a short insight: >> -> >> -> > http://forge.gridforum.org/sf/docman/do/downloadDocument/projects.pgi-wg/doc >> -> man.root.input_documents.execution_service/doc15635 >> -> >> -> >> -> So far, it looks like a reasonable good emerging standard lacking >> -> implementations I guess - but yet another JSDL extension... :-) >> -> >> -> Take care, >> -> Morris >> -> >> -> >> -> >> -> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> -> Morris Riedel >> -> SW - Engineer >> -> Distributed Systems and Grid Computing Division >> -> Jülich Supercomputing Centre (JSC) >> -> Forschungszentrum Juelich >> -> Wilhelm-Johnen-Str. 1 >> -> D - 52425 Juelich >> -> Germany >> -> >> -> Email: m.riedel(a)fz-juelich.de >> -> Info: http://www.fz-juelich.de/jsc/JSCPeople/riedel >> -> Phone: +49 2461 61 - 3651 >> -> Fax: +49 2461 61 - 6656 >> -> >> -> Skype: MorrisRiedel >> -> >> -> "We work to better ourselves, and the rest of humanity" >> -> >> -> Sitz der Gesellschaft: Jülich >> -> Eingetragen im Handelsregister des Amtsgerichts Düren Nr. HR B 3498 >> -> Vorsitzende des Aufsichtsrats: MinDirig'in Bärbel Brumme-Bothe >> -> Vorstand: Prof. Dr. Achim Bachem (Vorsitzender), >> -> Dr. Ulrich Krafft (stellv. Vorsitzender) >> -> >> -> >> ->> ------Original Message----- >> ->> -From: Moreno Marzolla [mailto:moreno.marzolla@pd.infn.it] >> ->> -Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 11:52 AM >> ->> -To: Morris Riedel >> ->> -Cc: 'Balazs Konya'; 'Steven Newhouse'; pgi-wg(a)ogf.org >> ->> -Subject: Re: [Pgi-wg] Promised document >> ->> - >> ->> -Morris Riedel wrote: >> ->> -> Hi team, >> ->> -> >> ->> ->> and had not seen any comment to Andrew¹s document? >> ->> -> >> ->> ->> - I haven't seen any real comments to the GES rendering document >> -> either. >> ->> -> >> ->> -> Yeah that was my idea with the factsheet, which had the views of > both >> ->> -> documents merged - but this was ignored and now we have again our > two >> ->> -> fronts... >> ->> - >> ->> -We will *always* have the two front, but I'll give my views later > during >> ->> -the teleconference. >> ->> -Anyway I should point out that during the last call there was no time >> ->> -left to discuss anything else, which in my opinion was fine anyway >> ->> -because we had the opportunity to understand the "GES realization via >> ->> -existing specification" document quite well. >> ->> - >> ->> -By the way, I've not yet put formal minutes of the last meetings on > the >> ->> -wiki. From my recallings, here they are (please double check the list > of >> ->> -participants, I remember that there was at least another person from > the >> ->> -University of Virginia but I do not remember the name): >> ->> - >> ->> ----------- >> ->> - >> ->> -Teleconference on 2009-05-13, 04:00 CET >> ->> - >> ->> -Presents: >> ->> - >> ->> -- Andrew Grimshaw >> ->> -- Aleksandr Konstantinov >> ->> -- Moreno Marzolla >> ->> -- Morris Riedel >> ->> -- Etienne Urbah >> ->> -- David Wallom >> ->> - >> ->> -Apologies: >> ->> - >> ->> -- Johannes Watzl >> ->> - >> ->> -Discussion: >> ->> - >> ->> -- Andrew illustrated in detail the document "GES realization via >> ->> -existing specifications" http://forge.ogf.org/sf/go/doc15630?nav=1 >> ->> -(version 1). >> ->> - >> ->> -- The discussion pinpointed some requirements (from the "Execution >> ->> -Service Strawman" document "http://forge.ogf.org/sf/go/doc15590?nav=1 > ) >> ->> -which are not clear enough. In particular, the requirement of "support >> ->> -for parallel jobs" should be clarified (e.g., state clearly what is >> ->> -intended by "parallel job"). >> ->> - >> ->> -- David suggested to check the "JSDL parameter sweep extension" draft > as >> ->> -it could allow describing a set of arbitrarily different jobs (for the >> ->> -requirement of bulk job submission to the execution service, which is > a >> ->> -feature currently not supported). >> ->> - >> ->> ----------- >> ->> - >> ->> -Moreno. >> ->> - >> ->> --- >> ->> -Moreno Marzolla >> ->> -INFN Sezione di Padova, via Marzolo 8, 35131 PADOVA, Italy >> ->> -EMail: moreno.marzolla(a)pd.infn.it Phone: +39 049 8277103 >> ->> -WWW : http://www.dsi.unive.it/~marzolla Fax : +39 049 8756233 >> -> >> -> _______________________________________________ >> -> Pgi-wg mailing list >> -> Pgi-wg(a)ogf.org >> -> http://www.ogf.org/mailman/listinfo/pgi-wg > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pgi-wg mailing list > Pgi-wg(a)ogf.org > http://www.ogf.org/mailman/listinfo/pgi-wg -- Dr Stephen Crouch, Software Architect, OMII-UK, Electronics and Computer Science, Room 4067, Level 4, Building 32, University of Southampton, Highfield, Southampton SO17 1BJ Tel: +44 (0)23 8059 8787 EMail: s.crouch(a)omii.ac.uk Fax: +44 (0)23 8059 3045 WWW: http://www.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~stc

2 1

Re: [Pgi-wg] Promised document
by Steven Newhouse 20 May '09

20 May '09

> still can get consensus that makes sense and not drift off like in an > IDL-like thinking where solutions come up that are not interoperable at > all... The 'IDL' approach has been found to be very useful to agree on the data structures in & out and the semantics of an operation without getting bogged down in rendering discussions. Rendering this agreed interface is then found to be very simple. This is exactly the process that has been used in doing the GLUE specification... and that drifting off activity seemed to work out OK! Steven

2 1

Re: [Pgi-wg] Promised document
by David Wallom 20 May '09

20 May '09

It is being implemented by OMII-UK David On 20/05/2009 12:30, "Morris Riedel" <m.riedel(a)fz-juelich.de> wrote: > Hi team, > >> - David suggested to check the "JSDL parameter sweep >> -extension" draft as it could allow describing a set of arbitrarily >> -different jobs (for the requirement of bulk job submission to the >> -execution service, which is a feature currently not supported). > > FYI: I did an excerpt of this standard yesterday, I put it on gridforge for > those that seek a short insight: > > http://forge.gridforum.org/sf/docman/do/downloadDocument/projects.pgi-wg/doc > man.root.input_documents.execution_service/doc15635 > > > So far, it looks like a reasonable good emerging standard lacking > implementations I guess - but yet another JSDL extension... :-) > > Take care, > Morris > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > Morris Riedel > SW - Engineer > Distributed Systems and Grid Computing Division > Jülich Supercomputing Centre (JSC) > Forschungszentrum Juelich > Wilhelm-Johnen-Str. 1 > D - 52425 Juelich > Germany > > Email: m.riedel(a)fz-juelich.de > Info: http://www.fz-juelich.de/jsc/JSCPeople/riedel > Phone: +49 2461 61 - 3651 > Fax: +49 2461 61 - 6656 > > Skype: MorrisRiedel > > "We work to better ourselves, and the rest of humanity" > > Sitz der Gesellschaft: Jülich > Eingetragen im Handelsregister des Amtsgerichts Düren Nr. HR B 3498 > Vorsitzende des Aufsichtsrats: MinDirig'in Bärbel Brumme-Bothe > Vorstand: Prof. Dr. Achim Bachem (Vorsitzender), > Dr. Ulrich Krafft (stellv. Vorsitzender) > > >> ------Original Message----- >> -From: Moreno Marzolla [mailto:moreno.marzolla@pd.infn.it] >> -Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 11:52 AM >> -To: Morris Riedel >> -Cc: 'Balazs Konya'; 'Steven Newhouse'; pgi-wg(a)ogf.org >> -Subject: Re: [Pgi-wg] Promised document >> - >> -Morris Riedel wrote: >> -> Hi team, >> -> >> ->> and had not seen any comment to Andrew¹s document? >> -> >> ->> - I haven't seen any real comments to the GES rendering document > either. >> -> >> -> Yeah that was my idea with the factsheet, which had the views of both >> -> documents merged - but this was ignored and now we have again our two >> -> fronts... >> - >> -We will *always* have the two front, but I'll give my views later during >> -the teleconference. >> -Anyway I should point out that during the last call there was no time >> -left to discuss anything else, which in my opinion was fine anyway >> -because we had the opportunity to understand the "GES realization via >> -existing specification" document quite well. >> - >> -By the way, I've not yet put formal minutes of the last meetings on the >> -wiki. From my recallings, here they are (please double check the list of >> -participants, I remember that there was at least another person from the >> -University of Virginia but I do not remember the name): >> - >> ----------- >> - >> -Teleconference on 2009-05-13, 04:00 CET >> - >> -Presents: >> - >> -- Andrew Grimshaw >> -- Aleksandr Konstantinov >> -- Moreno Marzolla >> -- Morris Riedel >> -- Etienne Urbah >> -- David Wallom >> - >> -Apologies: >> - >> -- Johannes Watzl >> - >> -Discussion: >> - >> -- Andrew illustrated in detail the document "GES realization via >> -existing specifications" http://forge.ogf.org/sf/go/doc15630?nav=1 >> -(version 1). >> - >> -- The discussion pinpointed some requirements (from the "Execution >> -Service Strawman" document "http://forge.ogf.org/sf/go/doc15590?nav=1 ) >> -which are not clear enough. In particular, the requirement of "support >> -for parallel jobs" should be clarified (e.g., state clearly what is >> -intended by "parallel job"). >> - >> -- David suggested to check the "JSDL parameter sweep extension" draft as >> -it could allow describing a set of arbitrarily different jobs (for the >> -requirement of bulk job submission to the execution service, which is a >> -feature currently not supported). >> - >> ----------- >> - >> -Moreno. >> - >> --- >> -Moreno Marzolla >> -INFN Sezione di Padova, via Marzolo 8, 35131 PADOVA, Italy >> -EMail: moreno.marzolla(a)pd.infn.it Phone: +39 049 8277103 >> -WWW : http://www.dsi.unive.it/~marzolla Fax : +39 049 8756233 > > _______________________________________________ > Pgi-wg mailing list > Pgi-wg(a)ogf.org > http://www.ogf.org/mailman/listinfo/pgi-wg

2 1

Profiling vs new specs
by Oxana Smirnova 20 May '09

20 May '09

Hi all, and sorry for missing recent calls - was busy with other meetings. You probably converged to some consensus regarding profiling and new specifications during one of the calls I missed - if you did, could you please outline the result? If not, I'd like to compare pros and contras of each approach. Andrew's "minimal changes" document advocating profiling seems to be larger than the GES strawman itself; this makes me wondering what is the definition of a "minimal change", and where is the margin when it is more efficient to introduce a new standard? My major concern about profiling is that different profiles of the same standard may easily turn out to be incompatible, even if each was perceived as a "minimal change" by the authors. Then the very idea of standard compliance gets void. I would prefer to avoid ambiguity as much as possible. There may be little semantic difference between different profiles of the same standard and different standards, but it can cause large practical implementation and operational implications. Cheers, Oxana

5 6

Re: [Pgi-wg] Promised document
by Morris Riedel 20 May '09

20 May '09

Team, further work with white flags between the fronts... Since fronts 1 and 2 coming closer I thought about the question what we really keep from BES vs. what we have to do new, here some thoughts taking the document from both fronts into account: ### BES portType level - BES-Factory #Keep portType to create activities #Re-define operation CreateActivity with new in-out-fault-elements ### BES portType level - BES-Activity #Keep portType to modify single activities (instead of using factory portType) #Add operations to modify single(vector) activities ### BES portType level - BES-Management #remove portType ### BES State Model #Add our proposed manual data-staging requirements that affect the states #Use GLUE2 syntax to describe it - but define new values for our additional states ### Information Model #Use GLUE2 instead #But definition of allowed values for GLUE2 structures #deprecate old information schemas (e.g. FactoryAttributes) #find ways to scale with outcome of available activities (e.g. EPR list) ### Resource Model #only WS-I I guess # no WS-RF agreement (or other profiles) Please correct/add if I'm somewhere wrong... Some thoughts, Morris ------------------------------------------------------------ Morris Riedel SW - Engineer Distributed Systems and Grid Computing Division Jülich Supercomputing Centre (JSC) Forschungszentrum Juelich Wilhelm-Johnen-Str. 1 D - 52425 Juelich Germany Email: m.riedel(a)fz-juelich.de Info: http://www.fz-juelich.de/jsc/JSCPeople/riedel Phone: +49 2461 61 - 3651 Fax: +49 2461 61 - 6656 Skype: MorrisRiedel "We work to better ourselves, and the rest of humanity" Sitz der Gesellschaft: Jülich Eingetragen im Handelsregister des Amtsgerichts Düren Nr. HR B 3498 Vorsitzende des Aufsichtsrats: MinDirig'in Bärbel Brumme-Bothe Vorstand: Prof. Dr. Achim Bachem (Vorsitzender), Dr. Ulrich Krafft (stellv. Vorsitzender) >------Original Message----- >-From: pgi-wg-bounces(a)ogf.org [mailto:pgi-wg-bounces@ogf.org] On Behalf Of >-Morris Riedel >-Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 2:18 PM >-To: 'Oxana Smirnova'; pgi-wg(a)ogf.org >-Subject: Re: [Pgi-wg] Promised document >- >-Yeah, >- >- I agree on this one document Oxana - but with obviously two fronts already >-established it's hard to agree on one and that's why I proposed to have this factsheet >-approach with both voices in it per item/operation - but this is not what the group >-wants obviously... :-) >- >- >-However, just that we are all sure that we have these fronts as follows: >- >- >-Front 1 >-Keeping BES/JSDL nearly as is and try to fit / squeeze solutions for the requirements >-in it or put them close to them (e.g. modify portType operations already existing). >- >- >-Front 2 >-Taking bits and pieces from BES/JSDL where it makes sense (w/o structures), but >-define a new structure (e.g. new portType operations) by still referencing to the origin >-in the respective source documents. >- >- >-Realistically, both fronts mean no backwards compatibility to a BES 1.0. >- >- >-Since the beginning it was 'start from scratch vs. not changing old elements'. >- >- >-Now, we have Front 1 willing to change views towards changing a few standard >-elements and Front 2 willing to keep elements (at least w/o structure) from good >-elements of the standard by creating a new structure. >- >- >-This already means we getting closer together over time - so I'm looking forward to >-further discussions today. >- >- >-End of the philosophical work, >-Morris >- >- >------------------------------------------------------------- >-Morris Riedel >-SW - Engineer >-Distributed Systems and Grid Computing Division Jülich Supercomputing Centre >-(JSC) Forschungszentrum Juelich Wilhelm-Johnen-Str. 1 D - 52425 Juelich >-Germany >- >-Email: m.riedel(a)fz-juelich.de >-Info: http://www.fz-juelich.de/jsc/JSCPeople/riedel >-Phone: +49 2461 61 - 3651 >-Fax: +49 2461 61 - 6656 >- >-Skype: MorrisRiedel >- >-"We work to better ourselves, and the rest of humanity" >- >-Sitz der Gesellschaft: Jülich >-Eingetragen im Handelsregister des Amtsgerichts Düren Nr. HR B 3498 Vorsitzende >-des Aufsichtsrats: MinDirig'in Bärbel Brumme-Bothe >-Vorstand: Prof. Dr. Achim Bachem (Vorsitzender), Dr. Ulrich Krafft (stellv. >-Vorsitzender) >- >- >->------Original Message----- >->-From: pgi-wg-bounces(a)ogf.org [mailto:pgi-wg-bounces@ogf.org] On Behalf Of >->-Oxana Smirnova >->-Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 1:55 PM >->-To: pgi-wg(a)ogf.org >->-Subject: Re: [Pgi-wg] Promised document >->- >->-Hi, >->- >->-20.05.2009 13:36, Morris Riedel пишет: >->-> Hi, >->-> >->->> - We will *always* have the two front, ... >->-> >->-> ... we shouldn't - in the end, all we want is interoperability and I hope we >->-> still can get consensus that makes sense and not drift off like in an >->-> IDL-like thinking where solutions come up that are not interoperable at >->-> all... >->-> >->- >->-Precisely, and to avoid two or three or N fronts, we must establish a >->-procedure. When a document is circulated for comments or additions, >->-these comments/additions should be attached/included to the circulated >->-document. They must not come in form of another document that in turns >->-demands a separate round of comments. >->- >->-So, let's take one document at a time, and let's formalize a bit the way >->-comments are submitted. Specifically, I find it convenient when comments >->-are in-line, and additions/corrections are inserted with tracing of >->-changes switched on. This will hopefully prevent opening new fronts. I >->-do not want to merge two or three or N documents, I want to finish work >->-on ONE document first. >->- >->-Cheers, >->-Oxana >->-_______________________________________________ >->-Pgi-wg mailing list >->-Pgi-wg(a)ogf.org >->-http://www.ogf.org/mailman/listinfo/pgi-wg

1 0

Re: [Pgi-wg] Promised document
by Oxana Smirnova 20 May '09

20 May '09

Hi, 20.05.2009 13:36, Morris Riedel пишет: > Hi, > >> - We will *always* have the two front, ... > > ... we shouldn't - in the end, all we want is interoperability and I hope we > still can get consensus that makes sense and not drift off like in an > IDL-like thinking where solutions come up that are not interoperable at > all... > Precisely, and to avoid two or three or N fronts, we must establish a procedure. When a document is circulated for comments or additions, these comments/additions should be attached/included to the circulated document. They must not come in form of another document that in turns demands a separate round of comments. So, let's take one document at a time, and let's formalize a bit the way comments are submitted. Specifically, I find it convenient when comments are in-line, and additions/corrections are inserted with tracing of changes switched on. This will hopefully prevent opening new fronts. I do not want to merge two or three or N documents, I want to finish work on ONE document first. Cheers, Oxana

2 1

Re: [Pgi-wg] Promised document
by Moreno Marzolla 20 May '09

20 May '09

Morris Riedel wrote: > Hi team, > >> and had not seen any comment to Andrew’s document? > >> - I haven't seen any real comments to the GES rendering document either. > > Yeah that was my idea with the factsheet, which had the views of both > documents merged - but this was ignored and now we have again our two > fronts... We will *always* have the two front, but I'll give my views later during the teleconference. Anyway I should point out that during the last call there was no time left to discuss anything else, which in my opinion was fine anyway because we had the opportunity to understand the "GES realization via existing specification" document quite well. By the way, I've not yet put formal minutes of the last meetings on the wiki. From my recallings, here they are (please double check the list of participants, I remember that there was at least another person from the University of Virginia but I do not remember the name): ---------- Teleconference on 2009-05-13, 04:00 CET Presents: - Andrew Grimshaw - Aleksandr Konstantinov - Moreno Marzolla - Morris Riedel - Etienne Urbah - David Wallom Apologies: - Johannes Watzl Discussion: - Andrew illustrated in detail the document "GES realization via existing specifications" http://forge.ogf.org/sf/go/doc15630?nav=1 (version 1). - The discussion pinpointed some requirements (from the "Execution Service Strawman" document "http://forge.ogf.org/sf/go/doc15590?nav=1 ) which are not clear enough. In particular, the requirement of "support for parallel jobs" should be clarified (e.g., state clearly what is intended by "parallel job"). - David suggested to check the "JSDL parameter sweep extension" draft as it could allow describing a set of arbitrarily different jobs (for the requirement of bulk job submission to the execution service, which is a feature currently not supported). ---------- Moreno. -- Moreno Marzolla INFN Sezione di Padova, via Marzolo 8, 35131 PADOVA, Italy EMail: moreno.marzolla(a)pd.infn.it Phone: +39 049 8277103 WWW : http://www.dsi.unive.it/~marzolla Fax : +39 049 8756233

2 2

Re: [Pgi-wg] More promised documents
by Balazs Konya 20 May '09

20 May '09

hi Morris, Morris Riedel wrote: > Actually, I learned another “Pro keeping BES” for the gridforge list by > learning that the state of computing activities in GLUE2(!) actually > points to BES states (!). That is actually not quite true. BES states are just listed as a set of possible values under the "BES:" namespace. BUT any other set of states can be published in glue2. Balazs Konya glue2 contributor

2 1

More promised documents
by Andrew Grimshaw 20 May '09

20 May '09

All, During the telecom I promised to send a commented version of the April 29 GES document. It is attached. Also attached is an updated, V-2, version of my earlier "realization" document, with changes to the requirements that we discussed. A

2 1

Next job management teleconference wednesday may 20th
by Moreno Marzolla 18 May '09

18 May '09

Dear all, the next PGI teleconference will be held on wednesday may 20th at 16:00 CET (duration: 1 hour). Call-in details as follow: via Skype call +9900827049931906 (free of charge) ordinary phone numbers (local rates) with the 9931906 conference number: Austria 0820 401 15470 Belgium 0703 57 134 France 0826 109 071 Germany +49 (0) 180 500 9527 Switzerland 0848 560 397 Agenda (please feel free to suggest additional items): 1) Resolve issues on the "GES Strawman", according to Andrew's comments:http://forge.ogf.org/sf/go/doc15633?nav=1 2) Additional discussion on "GES realization via existing specifications" (version 2 by Andrew has been uploaded to gridforge: http://forge.ogf.org/sf/go/doc15630?nav=1 ) 3) There is the feeling that reaching a consensus on the implementation of the job management interface is proving to be harder than expected. Should we focus our initial effort on defining (in plain English) a high level description for a job execution service based on an agreed set of requirements, so that we come out with a set of operations, input parameters and output data? Defining a suitable rendering of such interface could be the next step. Moreno. -- Moreno Marzolla INFN Sezione di Padova, via Marzolo 8, 35131 PADOVA, Italy EMail: moreno.marzolla(a)pd.infn.it Phone: +39 049 8277103 WWW : http://www.dsi.unive.it/~marzolla Fax : +39 049 8756233 _______________________________________________ Pgi-wg mailing list Pgi-wg(a)ogf.org http://www.ogf.org/mailman/listinfo/pgi-wg

1 0