September 2009 - ogsa-dmi-wg

Reminder DMI Telcon,
by Mario Antonioletti 30 Sep '09

30 Sep '09

Hi, Just a short reminder that we are having an OGSA-DMI Telcon tomorrow morning (1st Oct) at 8am (GMT+1). Previous actions: Agenda: - Discussion of progress - Planning Reminder, Dave's proposal is currently here: http://code.google.com/p/dtsproject/wiki/DMI_JSDL_Issues Call details ============ Participant access code: 23057332 then # Primary dial-in number: 0844 561 0081 or if dialling internationally +44 2078193600 Or local access alternatives: USA West Coast 4089616553 USA East Coast 7183541169 Germany (0)6950070811 Finland (0)969379595 Australia 0282239343 Actions ------- [MAA] To come up with a template document to explore if required functionality can be put in a spec addendum/new spec. Have started, have a very skeletal document. Hope to add a bit more and put something up. [MAA] Look at Shahbaz's WSRF DMI rendering. [MAA] Ask Allen to comment on the proposal on the wiki. Have had a discussion with Allen. Have forwarded Allen's email to the list. [DM] Enumerate the extensibility points required in the DMI spec. [DM] Add suggested changes to the text in the functional spec. [MAA] Try and get Steve Crouch involved. Steven said that he will try to attend. Mario +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+ |Mario Antonioletti:EPCC,JCMB,The King's Buildings,Edinburgh EH9 3JZ. | |Tel:0131 650 5141|mario@epcc.ed.ac.uk|http://www.epcc.ed.ac.uk/~mario/ | +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+ -- The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336.

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Re: [ogsa-dmi-wg] RFC (fwd)
by Mario Antonioletti 30 Sep '09

30 Sep '09

Commnts from Allen: -- The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 21:53:50 -0700 From: Allen Luniewski <luniew(a)us.ibm.com> To: Mario Antonioletti <mario(a)epcc.ed.ac.uk> Subject: Re: RFC Hi Mario, I am scanning my way through the reference below. Here are my comments. This is an old one but I stand by it. They are trying to define a protocol for moving files from multiple sources to multiple destinations. That is a perfectly fine goal. In the context of DMI there are two ways of looking at this: 1. First I believe that they could actually do everything they want to do with no changes to DMI. It would be rather awkward and would result in a very complex implementation, but it would be possible to do. I would not go down this route. 2. Second, if they really need a specific protocol for this situation, it should be done by building a new protocol that addresses this need. This new protocol would quite naturally be built on top of DMI. The point is that DMI was always intended to be a basic a protocol to move files from a single source to a single destination. And I strongly oppose any changes to that basic philosophy. Having said that, we were very vague about the information sent to DTI factory to create the DTI instance. It was vague enough that we all agreed that it could easily be used to send multiple files from one file system to another. But it is a trivial step from there to specifying files from multiple file systems (if nothing else remotely mounted file systems give you this). This is why I made comment #1 above. I am surprised at the comment that DMI is WSRF centric. I thought that we tried very hard to be neutral on that issue. But this is not my area of expertise so ... I am inclined to agree that the transfer options that we defined are insufficient to meet all cases. However, we also made it fully extensible via an ANY element so I it is a hard call whether or not it is appropriate to add the creationFlag element explicitly. I certainly would not issue a new DMI protocol version just for that! In the case at hand it is probably sufficient to let it be defined in the higher level protocol. In looking at this proposal please keep in mind the distinction between the abstract problem they are trying to solve (which needs a new protocol to resolve) and the particular implementation that they have in hand. Right now I think that they have mixed the two together. If I were still in the OGF game (which I am not - I am in the surgery recovery game right now), I would start a WG to define a higher level protocol to attack the multi-point problem. The solution in the proposal below is a good start as it addresses the basic issue: how to specify multiple sources and sinks. The hard question that this WG would need to address is how to handle status and errors from what are, inevitably. multiple independent transfers. Finally, I think that any argument that DMI should be modified in the way proposed below just to make DMI "more relevant" is an argument with no value and should be rejected. I apologize if I have not gone into enough depth on this. My energy levels are low as are my mental energy levels as my body is clearly entirely focused on healing from last week's knee surgery. But I will try and answer further questions in a reasonably timely manner. Allen Luniewski IBM WebSphere Commerce IBM Silicon Valley Laboratory 555 Bailey Ave. San Jose, CA 95141 408-463-2255 408-218-6998 (mobile) Inactive hide details for Mario Antonioletti <mario(a)epcc.ed.ac.uk> Mario Antonioletti <mario(a)epcc.ed.ac.uk>

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Thursday Telcon Postponed by a Week
by Mario Antonioletti 22 Sep '09

22 Sep '09

Hi, For a number of reasons the telcon that was scheduled to take place this Thursday on the 24th of September has been postponed by a week and will now be taking place on the 1st of October at 8am UK time (GMT+1). Apologies for any inconveniance caused. In the mean time it would be good if folks in the working group and interested parties could comment on David's page at: http://code.google.com/p/dtsproject/wiki/DMI_JSDL_Issues Apologies for an inconveniance that may have been caused, Mario +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+ |Mario Antonioletti:EPCC,JCMB,The King's Buildings,Edinburgh EH9 3JZ. | |Tel:0131 650 5141|mario@epcc.ed.ac.uk|http://www.epcc.ed.ac.uk/~mario/ | +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+ -- The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336.

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Notes from Today's Telcon
by Mario Antonioletti 11 Sep '09

11 Sep '09

DMI Telcon - 11 September 2009 ============================== Present ------- Mario Antonioletti, EPCC David Meredith, STFC Peter Turner, University of Sydney Gerson Galang, VeRSI Actions: -------- [MAA] To come up with a template document to explore if required functionality can be put in a spec addendum/new spec. [MAA] Look at Shahbaz's WSRF DMI rendering. [MAA] Ask Allen to comment on the proposal on the wiki. [DM] Enumerate the extensibility points required in the DMI spec. [DM] Add suggested changes to the text in the functional spec. [MAA] Try and get Steve Crouch involved. Completed Actions: ------------------ [MAA] Point folks to the Plain WS Rendering of the DMI spec. The document that went to public comment (and went down a black hole) is available from: http://www.ggf.org/Public_Comment_Docs/Documents/2009-01/ogsa-dmi-wsi-rende… The source for the document is at: http://forge.gridforum.org/sf/go/doc15259?nav=1 --- Mario apologised for not having been able to find the time to do the draft a straw man document for the multiple transfer DTI. In the meantime (or because of this) Dave posted out a proposal: http://code.google.com/p/dtsproject/wiki/DMI_JSDL_Issues It would be good if interested parties could comment on this (though wait until after September the 11th as Dave would like to add more content). In effect a number of changes are requested by the DataMinx folks: 1. Addition of a number of extensibility points to some of the existing elements in the functional spec. David Meredith will enumerate these on the wiki. 2. Changes to some of the text in the functional spec to make it a little less web service specific. The DataMinx folks would like to come up with a RESTful rendering specification and this would help them do this. 3. Be able to encapsulate multiple transfers within a single DTI. This needs to be scoped out and a straw man proposed. It is not clear as yet how this would be taken forward - suggested change to the existing spec, a new version of the spec or an addendum to the spec. This possibly the most contentious of all the suggested changes but it is hoped that once it is detailed and scoped it may be palatable to the working group as a whole. 4. Come up with a RESTful rendering for the DMI spec. Points 1 and 2 could be made to the existing specification, not clear how 3 is taken forward and once 1-3 are done then that allows 4 to take place. Mario is keen for this to take place if the specification is going to be adopted and used. He is going to try to come up with at least a template document that can then be iterated amongst the participants. It was suggested that it would be good if Steve Crouch could be involved. Mario is going to get in touch with him. Another telcon will take place in two weeks time to see what progress has been made. DONM: 8am UK time (GMT+1) on September 24th. +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+ |Mario Antonioletti:EPCC,JCMB,The King's Buildings,Edinburgh EH9 3JZ. | |Tel:0131 650 5141|mario@epcc.ed.ac.uk|http://www.epcc.ed.ac.uk/~mario/ | +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+ -- The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in Scotland, with registration number SC005336.

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phone meeting
by Meredith, David (STFC,DL,ESC) 10 Sep '09

10 Sep '09

Hi all, In preparation for tomorrows phone meeting (Mario, any details yet ?), please see the draft rendering proposal below that accounts for multiple transfers. Note, this would not require any changes to the existing DMI functional spec (other than adding the extension points as discussed previously), as it really only represents another rendering possibility. However, if this proposal (or something similar) was deemed suitable, then I think the text of the DMI functional spec would need modifying. Cheers, dave schema: http://code.google.com/p/dtsproject/source/browse/trunk/dts-jaxb/src/mai n/resources/archive/dmi-wrappedMessagesProposals.xsd example doc: http://code.google.com/p/dtsproject/source/browse/trunk/dts-jaxb/src/mai n/resources/archive/dmi-WrappedDataTransferRequest.xml ---------------------------------------------- David Meredith STFC eScience Centre Daresbury Laboratory (A32) Warrington, Cheshire WA4 4AD email: david.meredith(a)stfc.ac.uk tel: +44 (0) 1925 603762 -- Scanned by iCritical.

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