Hi all, I propose to discuss the following issues at the next OGF: - naming. Thus what terminology should we use? "port" or "interface", "topology" or "network". We mostly decided on this ("port", "topology"), but the NSI-WG asked for input (they now use "termination point" for and endpoint), and I prefer to use the same terms. So we can give them some feedback. - schema. Jeroen uploaded a recent version to the Gridforge website. We need to see if we got everything for the second deliverable (single layer schema), and who is willing to put this in a document. - identifiers. We discussed this in length. There are still disagreements, so let's see if we can nevertheless agree on how to move forward and don't let those differences hinder the process. (furthermore, there are some minor agenda items such as deliverable #1, but I'm sure the co-chairs will already put that on the agenda.) Regards, Freek
Hi all Could you please send to me and Martin an email if you intend to present during the NML-WG meetings in Catania? We have two sessions on Tuesday: - Tuesday March 3 11.00- 12.30 - Tuesday March3 14.00-15.30 At the moment the only presentation we have: - Jeroen vd Ham and F. Dijkstra "Identifiers" Regards, Paola
Hi all At the moment we have only two presentations scheduled for next week. If any of out there is interested in presenting let me know. Tuesday March 3 11.00- 12.30 ----------------------------------------- ** Agenda and introduction (co-chairs) (10 minutes) ** "VXDL (Virtual Execution Infrastructure Description Language)" (P. Primet & G. Koslovski) - Tuesday March3 14.00-15.30 ------------------------------------------ ** "Identifiers" (J. vd Ham and F. Dijkstra) Regards, Paola ps = let me just add here that for family reasons I will not be able to attend in person the meeting. I am planning on a tele-presence at the beginning of the morning session.
Paola - I or someone from NSI would like to present at the NML meetings. I would like to discuss the requirements of NSI and how the NSI model and the (current) NML model might be combined into a "unified field model" :) Aaron Brown has done some work on this and so has Chin Guok and others. It would be good to start discussion of this at NML. It would also be good to have NML representation at the NSI meetings where we talk about the NSI model and how to name the conceptual elements of the model. John On Feb 25, 2009, at 7:06 AM, Paola Grosso wrote:
Hi all
At the moment we have only two presentations scheduled for next week. If any of out there is interested in presenting let me know.
Tuesday March 3 11.00- 12.30 -----------------------------------------
** Agenda and introduction (co-chairs) (10 minutes)
** "VXDL (Virtual Execution Infrastructure Description Language)" (P. Primet & G. Koslovski)
- Tuesday March3 14.00-15.30 ------------------------------------------
** "Identifiers" (J. vd Ham and F. Dijkstra)
Regards, Paola
ps = let me just add here that for family reasons I will not be able to attend in person the meeting. I am planning on a tele-presence at the beginning of the morning session.
_______________________________________________ nml-wg mailing list nml-wg@ogf.org http://www.ogf.org/mailman/listinfo/nml-wg
John Vollbrecht Senior Network Engineer, Internet2 office 734 352 4960 cell 734 395 7890
John Vollbrecht wrote:
Paola -
I or someone from NSI would like to present at the NML meetings. I would like to discuss the requirements of NSI and how the NSI model and the (current) NML model might be combined into a "unified field model" :)
Aaron Brown has done some work on this and so has Chin Guok and others. It would be good to start discussion of this at NML. It would also be good to have NML representation at the NSI meetings where we talk about the NSI model and how to name the conceptual elements of the model.
John Perfect We will add this to the agenda. Do you have a preference on when to talk about this? Morning or afternoon?
Regards, Paola
I have no personal preference about times. Whatever would work best for you. John On Feb 25, 2009, at 11:33 AM, Paola Grosso wrote:
John Vollbrecht wrote:
Paola -
I or someone from NSI would like to present at the NML meetings. I would like to discuss the requirements of NSI and how the NSI model and the (current) NML model might be combined into a "unified field model" :)
Aaron Brown has done some work on this and so has Chin Guok and others. It would be good to start discussion of this at NML. It would also be good to have NML representation at the NSI meetings where we talk about the NSI model and how to name the conceptual elements of the model.
John Perfect We will add this to the agenda. Do you have a preference on when to talk about this? Morning or afternoon?
Regards, Paola
John Vollbrecht Senior Network Engineer, Internet2 office 734 352 4960 cell 734 395 7890
Hello all, As Paola said in her last mail, she will not be able to come to Catania. She has asked me to chair the session in her place. Below is a new version of the agenda:
Tuesday March 3 11.00- 12.30 -----------------------------------------
** Agenda, note taker and introduction (co-chairs) (10 minutes)
** Status deliverable 1 (5 minutes)
** "VXDL (Virtual Execution Infrastructure Description Language)" (P. Primet & G. Koslovski) (20 minutes + 10 minutes discussion)
** "Identifiers" (J. van der Ham and F. Dijkstra) (20 minutes + 10 minutes discussion)
- Tuesday March3 14.00-15.30 ------------------------------------------
** deliverable 2: outline and authors (30 minutes)
** Issue tracker proposal (F. Dijkstra) (10 minutes)
** "Requirements of NSI" (J. Vollbrecht) (20 minutes + 10 minutes discussion).
Jeroen.
This is the draft version of the meeting notes for the March 3rd, 2009 meeting of NML-WG second session at OGF 25, 14:00 - 15:30 CET. Please give comments and corrections. About 20 attendees have been present (please check) NML-WG Schema Definition Document ================================= Curently the following structure has been proposed and the persons giving/collecting input have been proposed - Introduction <- Jeroen van der Ham & Martin Swany - Schema <- Jeroen & Martin - Identifiers <- Lars Fischer - non-normative use examples <- Fred Dijkstra The original supposed chapter "Syntax" will be handled in a different document Document should be in Latex, so that no real editor is needed First draft to be ready at OGF26 Identifier discussion (urn:ogf:network:...) =========================================== Email to Joel Repogle by Richard Hughes-Jones & Jeroen for registration Joel will contact IANA for urn:ogf:network naming scheme Issues tracker (responsible Freek) ================================== - NSI Issues (John Vollbrecht & Freek) Slides of meeting will be put online by Martin & Jeroen ======================================================= Minutes of session will be provided by Freek and Ralph Niederberger =================================================================== Latex SVN repository (responsible Freek) ======================================== Freek made a short proposal =========================== Use cases are high level Freek would like to have a repository of use cases Describe small use cases e.g. a named link having a different name than its interfaces connected to the link http://forge.gridforum.org/sf/wiki/do/viewPage/projects.nml-wg/wiki/IssuesTr... Presentation: Network Services Interfaces by John Vollbrecht ============================================================ Status of NSI Generating a use case document & architecture document Concerning Architecture WG bi-weekly VC call since January A lot of issues found. See presentation for details Discussion led to set of "Issues documents" which provide info about thouhgts and decisions See: http://forge.gridforum.org/sf/docman/do/listDocuments/projects.nsi-wg/docman... NSi & NML collaboration in naming conventions is needed and desirable Many similarities and work items, so: Suggestion that NML and NSI have formal collaboration NSI-WG is working on Connection Oriented Network Service interface (Co-NSI) currently Requestor agent communicates with CO-NS agent via CO-NSI. Network Service Data Planes are connected via Link Connection Segments in a Multi-Domain Network Service. Data connections cross multiple Network Services Next Steps: Work on model of Network Service Work in user cases and how to describe them Create Architecture document by OGF268 Define required collaborations: NML, Security, Job Scheduling, others? Suggestions/Questions by audience: Which kind of security? What about Accounting and Authorization of Requesting ressources? Answers: Yes, these are also things to think about. How should collaboration be organized? - Send requests to NML or - direct discussion (e.g. live issue tracker) -> Wiki should be used Freek announces a "Terminology table" ========================================== This document is available via Gridforge. (only informational, that different standards use different terminologies and for checking, which terminology to use when talking to each other) best regards Ralph -- *************************************************** Ralph Niederberger Juelich Supercomputing Centre Institute for Advanced Simulation Phone: +49 2461 61-4772 Fax: +49 2461 61-6656 E-Mail: r.niederberger@fz-juelich.de WWW: http://www.fz-juelich.de/jsc/ JSC is the coordinator of the John von Neumann Institute for Computing and member of the Gauss Centre for Supercomputing *************************************************** Forschungszentrum Jülich GmbH 52425 Jülich Sitz der Gesellschaft: Jülich Eingetragen im Handelsregister des Amtsgerichts Düren Nr. HR B 3498 Vorsitzende des Aufsichtsrats: MinDirig'in Bärbel Brumme-Bothe Geschäftsführung: Prof. Dr. Achim Bachem (Vorsitzender), Dr. Ulrich Krafft (stellv. Vorsitzender), Prof. Dr. Harald Bolt, Dr. Sebastian M. Schmidt ***************************************************
NML 2009-03-03, morning session (Notes by Freek Dijkstra, Lars Fischer and Richard Hughes-Jones) WELCOME ======= Jeroen van der Ham and Martin Swany welcome everybody Jeroen is interim chair for this meeting along with Martin. Paola Grosso steps down as co-chair, Freek Dijkstra will follow her up after this meeting. DELIVERABLE 1 ============= deliverable sent out on mailing list no comments from group on deliverable 1. Deliverable #1 was sent to the area directors (Franco Travostino and Richard Hughes-Jones). Some doubt on procedures. Franco did ask for names of external reviewers. This was not required, as this is an informational document only (not a proposed standard). If the external reviewers have been asked, we will wait for their input. Otherwise, Franco and Richard will give informal feedback, and the document can be sent to the document editor. VXDL (PASCALE VICAT-BLANC PRIMET) ================================= Talk: Pascale Primet - VXDL: virtual exchange infrastructure description language. Slides: http://forge.gridforum.org/sf/go/doc15522 CARRIOCAS Project: service delivery over ultrahigh capacity networks - with a view to business models. The project describes short-lived overlay infrastructures over a fixed infrastructure. The language VXDL was developed to describes short-lived overlay infrastructures over a fixed infrastructure. It includes (1) list of individual resources and groups, (2) network topology, and (3) executing timeline. The topology description was developed in parallel to the NML, and it not equal, but the purpose is the same. Links can be described recursively (a link can contain other links). A UML diagram of VXDL is available at http://perso.ens-lyon.fr/guilherme.koslovski/download/vxdl.jpg Comparison of VXDL and NML elements (see slides) Pascale proposed to integrate VXDL with GLUE 2.0, which describes computing resources. Inder wondered how this works relates to JSDL, a job description language. Pascale: JSDL is for job description by end users, VXDL is used to describe virtual infrastructure by intermediate service providers. Suggestion to look more into this. Cees: are you describing all existing or available resources? Pascale: CARRIOCAS publishes functionality, not the availability. That is checked during reservation request. Comment: mapping between user request and and network provider descriptions. How do we map what VXDL (or JSDL) does into "what the network can provide" (as done in NML) - user requirement view vs. reseource / network capabilities view, and the mapping between those; answering "who can give me what I am asking for" Comment: there's a need for this - but this may not be for this workgroup; it needs to focus now and allow for this as a future extension. Pascale: virtualization is future Internet research. It is not clear were standardization should be done. IETF, IRTF, OGF, ... Inder: these communities (network and computing communities) do no understand each other at all, no common language. GLUE defines end-points, but no network. Martin: we try to form a liaison with them. For this reason, we asked a chair of GLUE for external review of the usage document (deliverable #1). Inder: other user still don't see the network as a configurable resource, and a collaboration is also an education to others. Short discussion on GENI and FIRE. Those communities currently are application-centric and lack repeatability of experiments. Virtualization working group had a notion of networks, but has been closed after inactivity. IDENTIFIERS =========== Summary talk: Jeroen van der Ham and Freek Dijkstra Slides: http://forge.gridforum.org/sf/go/doc15525 Identifiers contain a domain and opaque Parts. The structure of the opaque part is defined by each domain, and should not be interpreted by other domains. String-comparisons should be possible Several schemes are out there: NURN,URN, URL, GLIF. They are all basically the same We really need to make a decision - it's not very important which one we pick Agreement: we will propose "urn:ogf:network:<example.net>:[opaque part]" to the mailing list. URN:OGF: has to be registered. Richard will sent an e-mail to Joel Replogle. a. OGF will need to register "urn:ogf" with IANA (This requires IETF consensus action; per RFC3406, it seems to require a short informational RFC. Also it will need an OGF web page with the registration of the sub-divisions) b. OGF will have to approve use of the sub-division :network:
From the meeting notes:
Paola Grosso steps down as co-chair, Freek Dijkstra will follow her up after this meeting.
Paola, Allow me to publicly thank you for your cat-herding work you have done over the last two years (has it been that long?!). Now that our first deliverable is written, and have a preliminary schema for our second, I think we're on the right track. Thank you! Also my thanks goes to Jeroen for filling in as co-chair this meeting (while I was present, this was not certain at the time we had to book rooms). You did a great job -- I may even ask you again in the future ;-) Regards, Freek Dijkstra
Hi all
Allow me to publicly thank you for your cat-herding work you have done over the last two years (has it been that long?!). Now that our first deliverable is written, and have a preliminary schema for our second, I think we're on the right track.
Thank you!
It's been a pleasure for me too. See you at one of the next OGFs. Ciao, Paola
Ralph Niederberger wrote:
About 20 attendees have been present (please check)
Uh, 21, why do you want this checked? (I copied the attendee list. If someone really is interested, I can type the names)
Freek announces a "Terminology table" ========================================== This document is available via Gridforge.
http://forge.gridforum.org/sf/go/doc15512
(only informational, that different standards use different terminologies and for checking, which terminology to use when talking to each other)
It's a comparison between terminology of NML, G.805, NDL, cNIS, NM-WG, VXDL, and others. I tried to distinguish between different concepts. However, concepts often overlap, and technologies don't make a distinction between the two (e.g. between logical and physical devices). Feel free to make corrections yourself and upload to gridforge or mail them to me. I'm sure not everthing is perfect in there! Regards, Freek
participants (5)
-
Freek Dijkstra -
Jeroen van der Ham -
John Vollbrecht -
Paola Grosso -
Ralph Niederberger