Further comments in this version:
regards,
Tim Kimber, Common Transformation Team,
Hursley, UK
Internet: kimbert@uk.ibm.com
Tel. 01962-816742
Internal tel. 246742
| From:
| Stephanie Fetzer <sfetzer@us.ibm.com>
|
| To:
| Steve Hanson/UK/IBM@IBMGB
|
| Cc:
| dfdl-wg@ogf.org, dfdl-wg-bounces@ogf.org
|
| Date:
| 07/07/2010 13:43
|
| Subject:
| Re: [DFDL-WG] Action 086 Nils and Default
processing - draft 8 |
All:
After reviewing the changes proposed by Steve I'm glad that my suggested
mods were to be placed before the existing section (as he has changes everywhere!).
My suggestion would be an introductory paragraph at the start
of the section to set the stage for:
- why are we spending this whole section describing these concepts (why
are they important)
- why are we starting with our own definitions of terms
- how do these concepts fit together
I have some rough wording I'd like to start with for a proposal:
Processing of nils and defaults for parsing and unparsing relies on several
concepts and can be confusing unless explicitly described. We need to consider
the content of the datastream or the infoset, the cardinality of the elements
and sometimes their parents, and DFDL properties related to nill and default
values as well as syntax such as initiators and terminators.
For parsing we are looking at the incoming datastream and the DFDL properties
to determine what gets built into the infoset. This involves decisions
such as:
If the data is not in the datastream does this equate to
a default value, or a nill value, or nothing at all
in the created infoset?
For unparsing we are looking at the infoset and the DFDL properties to
determine what gets built into the output datastream. This involves
decisions such as:
If there is no value for an element in the
infoset do we need to create the initiator and terminator in the datastream?
We will start off by defining some terms which we will be used to make
describing the rules a little clearer.
If this is too 'light' for the spec we can always put in the tutorial/primer...but
I wanted to get some amount of high level overview together while we were
working through this.
Regards,
Stephanie Fetzer
WebSphere Common Transformation
Industry Packs - Software Engineer
| From:
| Steve Hanson <smh@uk.ibm.com>
|
| To:
| Alan Powell <alan_powell@uk.ibm.com>
|
| Cc:
| dfdl-wg@ogf.org
|
| Date:
| 07/07/2010 07:18 AM
|
| Subject:
| [DFDL-WG] Action 086 Nils and
Default processing - draft 8
|
| Sent by:
| dfdl-wg-bounces@ogf.org |
Hi Alan
I started to make comments but decided that it was easier to make changes
directly, so that is what I did. Comments that remain are for things that
need discussion (there's only a couple).
I made a lot of changes including sorting out your bullet numbering but
the main changes were:
a) The 'If ... Else If' logic had gone badly astray, because of combining
the non-initiator and initiator cases. It's not as compact as we thought
but still better combined I think.
b) "If 'is nil' with the content
region as the empty string"
- the content region clause is redundant. Your separate definition
of 'is nil' combined with being in a 'missing element' branch of the logic,
means just saying 'is ni' is sufficient.
c) Definition of nil when unparsing - does not need the useNilForDefaults
clause - nil and mssing are mutually exclusive when unparsing. The useNilForDefault
property comes into play via 'has default'.
Regards
Steve Hanson
Strategy, Common Transformation & DFDL
Co-Chair, OGF DFDL WG
IBM SWG, Hursley, UK,
smh@uk.ibm.com,
tel +44-(0)1962-815848
| From:
| Alan Powell/UK/IBM@IBMGB
|
| To:
| dfdl-wg@ogf.org
|
| Date:
| 02/07/2010 15:34
|
| Subject:
| [DFDL-WG] Fw: Fw: Fw: Fw: Action 086
Nils and Default processing - draft 7
|
| Sent by:
| dfdl-wg-bounces@ogf.org |
All
Latest draft (v7 )of the nils and default document incorporating comments
from this week.
Please send comments before next WG call.
Still having problems with bulleted lists
|
|
| Regards
|
|
|
| Alan Powell
|
|
|
| Development - MQSeries, Message Broker,
ESB
|
| IBM Software Group, Application and
Integration Middleware Software
|
| -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|
| IBM
|
| MP211, Hursley Park
|
| Hursley, SO21 2JN
|
| United Kingdom
|
| Phone: +44-1962-815073
|
| e-mail: alan_powell@uk.ibm.com |
----- Forwarded by Alan Powell/UK/IBM on 02/07/2010 15:32 -----
| From:
| Alan Powell/UK/IBM@IBMGB
|
| To:
| dfdl-wg@ogf.org
|
| Date:
| 30/06/2010 13:05
|
| Subject:
| [DFDL-WG] Fw: Fw: Fw: Action
086 Nils and Default processing |
All
Latest draft of the nils and default document incorporating comments from
last week.
As you will see I have been having problems with bulleted lists in word
which are still not correct but I assume I can fix for the spec.
|
|
| Regards
|
|
|
| Alan Powell
|
|
|
| Development - MQSeries, Message Broker,
ESB
|
| IBM Software Group, Application and
Integration Middleware Software
|
| -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|
| IBM
|
| MP211, Hursley Park
|
| Hursley, SO21 2JN
|
| United Kingdom
|
| Phone: +44-1962-815073
|
| e-mail: alan_powell@uk.ibm.com |
----- Forwarded by Alan Powell/UK/IBM on 30/06/2010 13:01 -----
| From:
| Steve Hanson/UK/IBM
|
| To:
| Alan Powell/UK/IBM@IBMGB
|
| Date:
| 25/06/2010 16:07
|
| Subject:
| Fw: [DFDL-WG] Fw: Fw: Action 086
Nils and Default processing |
Hi Alan - were you going to take the updates forward, or did you want me
to make some changes first?
Reviewed Steve's updates to the parsing and unparsing rules.
- it might be possible to simplify the nil processing in the rules by having
a defintion up front.
- 'nil indicator set' need a definition
- Discussion about whether 'usNilForDefaults' could be replaced by some
way of defining a literal, out of band value for the default.
- 'value' used when should be 'output value'
- dfdl:emptyValueDelimietrPolicy description should be moved from defaulting
section to initiator section.
- 'text markup' used in section 14.2 of spec
Regards
Steve Hanson
Strategy, Common Transformation & DFDL
Co-Chair, OGF DFDL WG
IBM SWG, Hursley, UK,
smh@uk.ibm.com,
tel +44-(0)1962-815848
----- Forwarded by Steve Hanson/UK/IBM on 25/06/2010 16:00 -----
| From:
| Steve Hanson/UK/IBM
|
| To:
| dfdl-wg@ogf.org
|
| Date:
| 23/06/2010 11:18
|
| Subject:
| Re: [DFDL-WG] Fw: Fw: Action 086
Nils and Default processing |
Here's my latest updates. As discussed I have reworked the 'Nils
& Defaults on parsing/unparsing' sections.
One question was thrown up. On parsing when a required complex element
is missing, we add it to the infoset as long as applying default processing
to its missing children does not cause an error. You will see I have used
the phrase 'Missing element processing
is applied to all child elements.'
to cover this. But 'Missing element processing' as now spelled out
in the same section includes 'nillable and empty string' processing when
the child is simple. Does this apply here?
[attachment "dfdl-nils-defaults-v5-SMH.doc" deleted by Alan Powell/UK/IBM]
Regards
Steve Hanson
Strategy, Common Transformation & DFDL
Co-Chair, OGF DFDL WG
IBM SWG, Hursley, UK,
smh@uk.ibm.com,
tel +44-(0)1962-815848
| From:
| Steve Hanson/UK/IBM
|
| To:
| Alan Powell/UK/IBM@IBMGB
|
| Cc:
| dfdl-wg@ogf.org
|
| Date:
| 16/06/2010 14:40
|
| Subject:
| Re: [DFDL-WG] Fw: Fw: Action 086
Nils and Default processing |
Hi Alan
I've updated the document and added some comments. Still quite a bit to
discuss.
Regards
Steve Hanson
Strategy, Common Transformation & DFDL
Co-Chair, OGF DFDL WG
IBM SWG, Hursley, UK,
smh@uk.ibm.com,
tel +44-(0)1962-815848
| From:
| Alan Powell/UK/IBM@IBMGB
|
| To:
| dfdl-wg@ogf.org
|
| Date:
| 02/06/2010 11:21
|
| Subject:
| [DFDL-WG] Fw: Fw: Action 086 Nils
and Default processing
|
| Sent by:
| dfdl-wg-bounces@ogf.org |
I have updated based on last weeks call
|
|
| Regards
|
|
|
| Alan Powell
|
|
|
| Development - MQSeries, Message Broker,
ESB
|
| IBM Software Group, Application and
Integration Middleware Software
|
| -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|
| IBM
|
| MP211, Hursley Park
|
| Hursley, SO21 2JN
|
| United Kingdom
|
| Phone: +44-1962-815073
|
| e-mail: alan_powell@uk.ibm.com |
----- Forwarded by Alan Powell/UK/IBM on 02/06/2010 11:20 -----
| From:
| Alan Powell/UK/IBM@IBMGB
|
| To:
| dfdl-wg@ogf.org
|
| Date:
| 25/05/2010 17:27
|
| Subject:
| [DFDL-WG] Fw: Action 086 Nils and Default
processing |
All
I have added unparsing and corrected some of the existing information in
this latest version.
I did attempt to write out the dfdl:nilValueDelimiterPolicy and dfdl:emptyValueDelimiterPolicy
options in full but it became unreadable hence the 'as controlled by' short
cut.
Links still don't work
|
| Regards
|
|
|
| Alan Powell
|
|
|
| Development - MQSeries, Message Broker,
ESB
|
| IBM Software Group, Application and
Integration Middleware Software
|
| -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|
| IBM
|
| MP211, Hursley Park
|
| Hursley, SO21 2JN
|
| United Kingdom
|
| Phone: +44-1962-815073
|
| e-mail: alan_powell@uk.ibm.com |
----- Forwarded by Alan Powell/UK/IBM on 25/05/2010 17:22 -----
| From:
| Alan Powell/UK/IBM
|
| To:
| dfdl-wg@ogf.org
|
| Date:
| 13/05/2010 17:28
|
| Subject:
| Action 086 Nils and Default processing |
All
Attached is an updated version of the nils and defaults sections of the
specification. I have only completed the parsing section so far which you
should be able to review while I am on vacation. If someone would like
to add the unparsing section that would be great.
| Note that the cross references
are not correct.
|
| Regards
|
|
|
| Alan Powell
|
|
|
| Development - MQSeries, Message Broker,
ESB
|
| IBM Software Group, Application and
Integration Middleware Software
|
| -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|
| IBM
|
| MP211, Hursley Park
|
| Hursley, SO21 2JN
|
| United Kingdom
|
| Phone: +44-1962-815073
|
| e-mail: alan_powell@uk.ibm.com |
Unless stated otherwise above:
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741598.
Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6
3AU
#### dfdl-nils-defaults v2.doc moved to MyAttachments Repository V3.8 (Link)
on 23 May 2010 by Alan Powell.
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#### dfdl-nils-defaults v4.doc moved to MyAttachments Repository V3.8 (Link)
on 08 June 2010 by Steve Hanson.
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741598.
Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6
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#### dfdl-nils-defaults-v4-SMH.doc moved to MyAttachments Repository V3.8
(Link)
on 22 June 2010 by Steve Hanson.
Unless stated otherwise above:
IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number
741598.
Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6
3AU
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741598.
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[attachment "dfdl-nils-defaults-v6.1.doc" deleted by Alan Powell/UK/IBM]
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