I think my suggestion of not supporting time zones with optional seconds has put us into an inconsistent place. I've just re-read the ICU SimpleDateFormat class entry for Z, reproduced below. I had not spotted that Z, Z, ZZZ now also imply optional seconds, and are equivalent to 'xxxx' which we said we don't support. Z 1..3 -0800 The ISO8601 basic format with hours, minutes and optional seconds fields. The format is equivalent to RFC 822 zone format (when optional seconds field is absent). This is equivalent to the "xxxx" specifier. 4 GMT-8:00 The long localized GMT format. This is equivalent to the "OOOO" specifier. 5 -08:00 -07:52:58 The ISO8601 extended format with hours, minutes and optional seconds fields. The ISO8601 UTC indicator "Z" is used when local time offset is 0. This is equivalent to the "XXXXX" specifier. We've always supported Z (as RFC 822) so we can't now drop Z 1..3. Regards Steve Hanson Architect, IBM Data Format Description Language (DFDL) Co-Chair, OGF DFDL Working Group IBM SWG, Hursley, UK smh@uk.ibm.com tel:+44-1962-815848 ----- Forwarded by Steve Hanson/UK/IBM on 17/09/2013 15:21 ----- From: Mike Beckerle <mbeckerle.dfdl@gmail.com> To: Steve Hanson/UK/IBM@IBMGB, Date: 30/08/2013 00:25 Subject: Re: Time zones with seconds - Re: errata r14.1, and spec internal draft with these integrated in - review #3 Made this change. Also, updated Errata 2.3 (Unsure about the references at the top of that errata description. Mike Beckerle | OGF DFDL Workgroup Co-Chair | Tresys Technology | www.tresys.com Please note: Contributions to the DFDL Workgroup's email discussions are subject to the OGF Intellectual Property Policy On Wed, Aug 28, 2013 at 11:38 AM, Steve Hanson <smh@uk.ibm.com> wrote: Agreed that the ICU symbol combinations below that include optional seconds will not be supported in DFDL 1.0. Erratum 2.121 will be updated. Regards Steve Hanson Architect, IBM Data Format Description Language (DFDL) Co-Chair, OGF DFDL Working Group IBM SWG, Hursley, UK smh@uk.ibm.com tel:+44-1962-815848 From: Mike Beckerle <mbeckerle.dfdl@gmail.com> To: Steve Hanson/UK/IBM@IBMGB, Cc: "Cranford, Jonathan W." <jcranford@mitre.org>, Suman Kalia < kalia@ca.ibm.com>, Tim Kimber/UK/IBM@IBMGB Date: 24/08/2013 04:04 Subject: Time zones with seconds - Re: errata r14.1, and spec internal draft with these integrated in - review #3 One question - do we really need to support time zones with seconds? If we think this is not needed then we could drop ZZZZZ, xxxx, xxxxx, XXXX, XXXXX, and stick with standard ISO8601. I would be happy to remove these, and I have no clue the meaning or use of a time zone with seconds. I have edited in the other ICU calendar pattern review comments, but this is outstanding. Let's close on this on next WG call. Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU Unless stated otherwise above: IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598. Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU