Suman

We discussed the options on the call and decided that forcing multiple formats statement on every element (which is what WMB does) was too cumbersome.

Selectors do not change inheritance rules at all so your questions are the same whether selectors are used or not.
We felt the selectors rule were fairly simple and once it has been decided which format block to use normal scoping rules apply.

Alan Powell

MP 211, IBM UK Labs, Hursley,  Winchester, SO21 2JN, England
Notes Id: Alan Powell/UK/IBM     email: alan_powell@uk.ibm.com  
Tel: +44 (0)1962 815073                  Fax: +44 (0)1962 816898


From: Suman Kalia <kalia@ca.ibm.com>
To: Alan Powell/UK/IBM@IBMGB
Cc: dfdl-wg@ogf.org, dfdl-wg-bounces@ogf.org
Date: 06/11/2008 23:21
Subject: Re: [DFDL-WG] DFDL: Minutes from OGF WG call, 05 Octobet 2008





>> 2. Selectors

>> Discussed Suman's suggestion from last weeks call.
>> - If a selector is supplied, then only dfdl:format blocks matching that selector are used
>> - If a selector is not supplied, then only dfdl:format blocks without a selector are used

>> Decided this is too restrictive as it requires a format block for each selector on every item even if they define the same properties so stayed with previous decision

>> - If selector is supplied and matches one of the dfdl:format blocks then that block is used.
>> - Otherwise the dfdl:format block with no selector is used.

>> Reiterated that selectors are qnames.

Alan - I think it will add more complexity and it will be difficult for the user to comprehend the exact set of annotations that would be applicable on the element.  This becomes more complicated when you take inheritance of annotations into account.  Say grandparent A has annotation with selector xyz , parent  B & its child C has annotation with no selector.  When processing for selector xyz,  which annotations will be applicable for child C - will it inherit annotations from grandparent A (which has same selector) or  parent B (which has annotation with no selector specified) ?.   What if grand child C had no dfdl annotation specified ?

Suman Kalia
IBM Toronto Lab
WMB Toolkit Architect and Development Lead
WebSphere Business Integration Application Connectivity Tools
Tel : 905-413-3923  T/L  969-3923
Fax : 905-413-4850 T/L  969-4850
Internet ID : kalia@ca.ibm.com

From: Alan Powell <alan_powell@uk.ibm.com>
To: dfdl-wg@ogf.org
Date: 11/06/2008 11:55 AM
Subject: [DFDL-WG] DFDL: Minutes from OGF WG call, 05 Octobet 2008




Open Grid Forum: Data Format Description Language Working Group

Weekly Working Group Conference Call
13:00 GMT, 5 November 2008


Attendees

Steve Hanson (IBM)
Mike Beckerle(Oco)
Alan Powell (IBM)

1. End Of Parent
Discussed last proposal and subsequent emails.

Decided:
Only last element in a sequence can have lenghtkind=EndOfParent
Sequence can also have lengthKind=EndOfParent - means take length from parent sequence.
LengthKind=endOfParent on outermost sequence means end of data stream. So for the last field in a definition to extend to the end of the data stream the element has lengthKind="endOfParent" and the enclosing sequence,  and all parent sequences including outermost also have lengthKind="endOfParent"

Examples

1. Last element to end of data stream
 <xsd:sequence>
  <xsd:annotation>
    <xsd:appinfo source="http://www.ogf.org/dfdl/">
      <dfdl:format lengthKind="endOfParent" />
    </xsd:appinfo>
  </xsd:annotation>

  <xs:element name="mandt" type="xsd:string"/>
     <xsd:annotation>
      <xsd:appinfo source="http://www.ogf.org/dfdl/">
        <dfdl:format lengthKind="explicit" length="3"/>
      </xsd:appinfo>
    </xsd:annotation>
  </xsd:element>
  ....
  <xs:element name="last" type="xsd:string"/>
    <xsd:annotation>
      <xsd:appinfo source="http://www.ogf.org/dfdl/">
         <dfdl:format lengthKind="endOfParent"/>
       </xsd:appinfo>
    </xsd:annotation>
  </xsd:element>
</xsd:sequence>

2. last element to fixed length container

 <xsd:sequence>
  <xsd:annotation>
    <xsd:appinfo source="http://www.ogf.org/dfdl/">
      <dfdl:format lengthKind="explicit" length="100" />
    </xsd:appinfo>
  </xsd:annotation>

  <xs:element name="mandt" type="xsd:string"/>
     <xsd:annotation>
      <xsd:appinfo source="http://www.ogf.org/dfdl/">
        <dfdl:format lengthKind="explicit" length="3"/>
      </xsd:appinfo>
    </xsd:annotation>
  </xsd:element>
  ....
  <xs:element name="last" type="xsd:string"/>
    <xsd:annotation>
      <xsd:appinfo source="http://www.ogf.org/dfdl/">
         <dfdl:format lengthKind="endOfParent"/>
       </xsd:appinfo>
    </xsd:annotation>
  </xsd:element>
</xsd:sequence>

3. last element to container terminator

 <xsd:sequence>
  <xsd:annotation>
    <xsd:appinfo source="http://www.ogf.org/dfdl/">
      <dfdl:format lengthKind="delimited" terminator="$" />
    </xsd:appinfo>
  </xsd:annotation>

  <xs:element name="mandt" type="xsd:string"/>
     <xsd:annotation>
      <xsd:appinfo source="http://www.ogf.org/dfdl/">
        <dfdl:format lengthKind="explicit" length="3"/>
      </xsd:appinfo>
    </xsd:annotation>
  </xsd:element>
  ....
  <xs:element name="last" type="xsd:string"/>
    <xsd:annotation>
      <xsd:appinfo source="http://www.ogf.org/dfdl/">
         <dfdl:format lengthKind="endOfParent"/>
       </xsd:appinfo>
    </xsd:annotation>
  </xsd:element>
</xsd:sequence>

Isn't this the same as "last " with lengthKind = "delimited"?
   
2. Selectors

Discussed Suman's suggestion from last weeks call.
- If a selector is supplied, then only dfdl:format blocks matching that selector are used
- If a selector is not supplied, then only dfdl:format blocks without a selector are used

Decided this is too restrictive as it requires a format block for each selector on every item even if they define the same properties so stayed with previous decision

- If selector is supplied and matches one of the dfdl:format blocks then that block is used.
- Otherwise the dfdl:format block with no selector is used.

Reiterated that selectors are qnames.

3. Moving to XSD 1.1 as base for DFDL

Benfits:
Can use xsd:all instead of introducing unordered sequences.
weakened wildcard rules.

Agreed in principle. MB to investigate to look at the other changes in Schema 1.1 to check effect on other dfdl functions and restrictions

4. Not dicussed

SCD spec changes
Multi-level semntics

2. AOB
Next call 12 November

Meeting closed, 13:10 GMT

Actions raised at this meeting
No
Action
023
MB: Review Schema 1.1

Current Actions:
No
Action
003
AP: Update spec from WTX document
13/8:  All resolved issues have been added to spec. Remaining unresolved items need discussion
10/9: Alan will pull out the remaining unresolved items and circulate for discussion next week
17/9: Doc distributed and partially discussed
15/10: All updateds complete except minlength
22/10: No update
004
MB: Mike will also author a new section in response to comments from Sandy Gao and Suman Kalia, explicitly connecting syntax with DFDL semantics
16/7: no progress
10/9: Mike not convinced this is necessary. Steve to talk to Sandy to see if it is needed for any IBM implementation that extends the existing XML parsing framework
15/10: SH to talk to Sandy
22/10: SH needs reminding of what this issue is about
007
AP: enum + expression wording
13/8: no progress
10/9: No update
17/9: No update
22/10: No update
012
AP/SH: Update decimalCalendarScheme
10/9: Not allocated yet
17/9: No update
24/9: Add calendar binary formats to actions
22/10: No progress
014
SH: Use cases for lengthKind pattern on binary fields.
10/9: Not done
17/9: No update
22/10: SH not sure he can provide a concrete use case
016
AP: Add hidden changes to spec
22/10: No update
017
All: Review EndOfData changes
22/10: SH response mailed to Mike
018
AP: Agree padding to minimum length
15/10: Needs documenting
22/10: No update
019
AP: Document defineTextNumber etc
22/10: No update
020
SH: Resolve packedDecimalSignCodes behaviour depends on NumberCheckPolicy
22/10: No progress
021
AP: Document textNumberRepresenation and binaryNumberRepresentation
22/10: No update
022
SH: Talk to Sandy Gao to assess use of schema 1.1
22/10: Mail sent to Sandy

Closed actions:

033 Work items:
No
Item
001
String XML type (Ian P) - Apr 30, 2008
002
Escape schemes (Ian P) - Apr 30, 2008
003
Variables - ??, 2008 (Mike)
004
Selectors (Suman/Alan) - Apr 30, 2008
005
Improvements on property descriptions - ??, 2008 (All - split TBD)
006
Envelopes and Payloads (Steve) - Apr 30, 2008
007
(from draft 32) valueCalc (Mike) - ??, 2008 *Mostly complete*
008
(from draft 32) Property precedence for writing (Steve) - *complete but under review*
009
(from draft 32) Variable markup (Steve) - Mar 31, 2008 *proposal needs writing up*
010
(from draft 32) Assertions, discriminators and choice, including discussion of timing option (Suman) - Mar 31, 2008 * in progress *
011
(from draft 32) How speculative parsing works (combining choice and variable-occurence - currently these are separate) ??, 2008 (IBM) * in progress *
012
(from draft 32) Reordering the properties discussion: move representation earlier, improve flow of topics ??, 2008 (Alan) * not started *
013
(from F2F) New scoping rules
014
(from F2F) Occurs, OccurSeparator changes
015
(from F2F) choices and Output (Mike)
016
(from F2F) xpath forward references (Alan) *complete*
017
(IBM WTX review) Minor agreed updates (Alan) *complete*
018
(IBM WTX review) Review generateNewLine (Alan) *complete*
020
(IBM WTX review) Special value for zero seen eg 'zero'. (Steve)
021
(IBM WTX review) 'EndOfData' changes (Alan)
022
(IBM WTX review) Unresolvable choices - infoset changes *complete*
023
(IBM WTX review) separatorKind=’prefix’ ‘infix’ or ‘postfix’ (Alan)
024
(IBM WTX review)  StopValue clarification (Alan)  
025
Augmented infoset and unparsing (Alan)  
026
Hidden changes
027
Add decimal supp to main spec
028
Remove extended floats



Alan Powell

MP 211, IBM UK Labs, Hursley,  Winchester, SO21 2JN, England
Notes Id: Alan Powell/UK/IBM     email: alan_powell@uk.ibm.com  
Tel: +44 (0)1962 815073                  Fax: +44 (0)1962 816898

Unless stated otherwise above:
IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 741598.
Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU





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Unless stated otherwise above:
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Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU