- dfdl-wg - lists.ogf.org

GGF13
by Steve Hanson 07 Feb '05

07 Feb '05

Are folk in the DFDL WG planning on attending GGF 13 in Seoul? Or would it be more productive to have a separate DFDL WG face-to-face in the US? Regards, Steve Steve Hanson WebSphere Business Integration Brokers, IBM Hursley, England Internet: smh(a)uk.ibm.com Phone (+44)/(0) 1962-815848

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RE: [dfdl-wg] Open source DFDL implementation?
by mike.beckerle＠ascentialsoftware.com 02 Feb '05

02 Feb '05

Our implementation will be open source. Ascential open source is a "dual use" kind of license. Basically means Ascential can do what it wants with the software including offer commercial terms, for everyone else it's like the GPL with the additional requirement that any mods you make to the software are relicensed back to Ascential. There are other licenses like this e.g., mySql and cygwin, I'm told there are others as well. This particular implementation is not intended to be production quality so I'm not sure the commercial terms matter in the above license. This implementation is being designed from the ground up to be simple, clear, and easily modified so that as we iron out the exact semantics of DFDL we can do so with a real implementation. These goals are in tension with performance, which we're punting on entirely. So, for example, almost all the Java object classes in this implementation are immutable objects. This makes the code dead-simple, but implies lots of object allocation and garbage collection during execution. We expect several objects to be allocated and discarded for every bit of input that is touched when reading data, for example. The GGF doesn't do "reference implementations", so I'm calling this thing an "Informational Implementation", but the spirit is the same. Our DFDL spec documents can be far clearer if we have an implementation that is easy and quick to modify, and one we can run real tests against readily as we debate the fine points.Our goal at Ascential is for this implementation to exactly match the standard. Other minor details: We're writing it in pure Java in the latest Java dialect, Java 1.5, making heavy use of generic types to simplify the code. ...mikeb _____ From: owner-dfdl-wg(a)ggf.org [mailto:owner-dfdl-wg@ggf.org] On Behalf Of Susan Malaika Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2005 3:45 AM To: dfdl-wg(a)gridforum.org Subject: [dfdl-wg] Open source DFDL implementation? People have mentioned various implementations of DFDL on this mailing list. Will any of them be open source? Susan Malaika

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Open source DFDL implementation?
by Susan Malaika 02 Feb '05

02 Feb '05

People have mentioned various implementations of DFDL on this mailing list. Will any of them be open source? Susan Malaika

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Phone meetings
by Myers, James D 01 Feb '05

01 Feb '05

FYI: I'm going to be on travel for the next two scheduled calls - tomorrow and the 16th. Tomorrow I think I'm on a plane during that time while I might be able to call in by cell phone the 16th. Just an FYI unless others would be interested in switching to the 9th. In any case, I'd like to have Tara Talbott start joining the calls. As a quick introduction - she's been working on our Scientific Annotation Middleware and electronic notebook at PNNL and, with our new funding, will be looking into DFDL development. She's done some work on our BFD implmentation and writing BFD descriptions of data as well so she's familiar with that and how we use BFD in SAM. Until she gets signed up on the dfdl list, could you keep her cc'd on replies? Jim

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RE: [dfdl-wg] domain name - dataformat.org
by mike.beckerle＠ascentialsoftware.com 01 Feb '05

01 Feb '05

I have discovered that if you let a domain expire somebody always snaps it up. I'll check into parking dfdl.info ...mikeb > -----Original Message----- > From: Martin Westhead [mailto:martinwesthead@yahoo.co.uk] > Sent: Monday, January 31, 2005 12:04 PM > To: mike.beckerle(a)ascentialsoftware.com > Cc: dfdl-wg(a)gridforum.org > Subject: Re: [dfdl-wg] domain name - dataformat.org > > mike.beckerle(a)ascentialsoftware.com wrote: > > > > I was checking into domains, as we've been writing things like > > dfdl.org into example code and slideware. > > > > dfdl.org is owned by some french or swiss foundation.. As a result > > dfdl.com/.net are owned by some web-name extorter. (For any > .org name > > you'll find highly likely that the .com and .net of the > same name are > > reserved by some company which will charge to sell it to you.) > > That's annoying. I know that dfdl.org was available when I > chose the name, and I bought the domain at the time as a > place holder. My ownership must have expired...:( > > I notice that dfdl.info is still available perhaps you could > get ascential to park that one too? > > Also if we were to spell it dafodel (Um yuk), dafodel.org and > dafodel.com are (not surprisingly still available). > > Martin >

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domain name - dataformat.org
by mike.beckerle＠ascentialsoftware.com 31 Jan '05

31 Jan '05

I was checking into domains, as we've been writing things like dfdl.org into example code and slideware. dfdl.org is owned by some french or swiss foundation.. As a result dfdl.com/.net are owned by some web-name extorter. (For any .org name you'll find highly likely that the .com and .net of the same name are reserved by some company which will charge to sell it to you.) dataformat.com/.net is owned and in use by a company based in florida. However, amazingly dataformat.org is available, so I've asked Ascential to park this domain. That is, reserve it, to avoid anyone else grabbing it out from under us. When the right time comes we'll transfer this domain to whomever the right organization is. So if you are noodling around in xml e.g., creating things like <appinfo source="..."> lines, you can put http://dataformat.org <http://dataformat.org> in as the source; however, don't put dfdl.org in there, since that's a known and used domain name, and we want to stay out of brand/name/controversy. ...mikeb

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RE: [dfdl-wg] Microsoft Biztalk Flat File Extensions
by mike.beckerle＠ascentialsoftware.com 28 Jan '05

28 Jan '05

Yup. I thought the same thing. Philosophically all very similar. Different in all the details. Like the IBM system it's quite machine-centric. I think we're shooting for a notch more human-intelligibility in the DFDL-WG currently. However, I'm a bit biased to NOT reach out to Microsoft and twist their arm for participation in our WG just yet. Not until we've made a bit more progress. We're really cranking on a prototype here at Ascential and I want to avoid distractions currently. ...mikeb _____ From: Suman Kalia [mailto:kalia@ca.ibm.com] Sent: Friday, January 28, 2005 9:30 AM To: mike.beckerle(a)ascentialsoftware.com Cc: dfdl-wg(a)gridforum.org Subject: Fw: [dfdl-wg] Microsoft Biztalk Flat File Extensions Mike -- This seems quite similar to the proposal I submited based on Type Descriptor. They have a schema for the physical representation and the instances of which (eg. recordInfo, fieldInfo etc) appear as annotations on schema elements , attributes etc. Suman Kalia IBM Toronto Lab WebSphere Business Integration Application Connectivity Tools Tel : 905-413-3923 T/L 969-3923 Fax : 905-413-4850 Internet ID : kalia(a)ca.ibm.com ----- Forwarded by Suman Kalia/Toronto/IBM on 01/28/2005 09:20 AM ----- mike.beckerle(a)ascentialsoftware.com Sent by: owner-dfdl-wg(a)ggf.org 01/28/2005 04:36 AM To dfdl-wg(a)gridforum.org cc Subject [dfdl-wg] Microsoft Biztalk Flat File Extensions Microsoft has a completely proprietary but otherwise DFDL-like thing in its bag of tricks too: see <http://www.winterdom.com/dev/bts/BTSFFSchemaTut2.html> http://www.winterdom.com/dev/bts/BTSFFSchemaTut2.html

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Fw: [dfdl-wg] Microsoft Biztalk Flat File Extensions
by Suman Kalia 28 Jan '05

28 Jan '05

Mike -- This seems quite similar to the proposal I submited based on Type Descriptor. They have a schema for the physical representation and the instances of which (eg. recordInfo, fieldInfo etc) appear as annotations on schema elements , attributes etc. Suman Kalia IBM Toronto Lab WebSphere Business Integration Application Connectivity Tools Tel : 905-413-3923 T/L 969-3923 Fax : 905-413-4850 Internet ID : kalia(a)ca.ibm.com ----- Forwarded by Suman Kalia/Toronto/IBM on 01/28/2005 09:20 AM ----- mike.beckerle(a)ascentialsoftware.com Sent by: owner-dfdl-wg(a)ggf.org 01/28/2005 04:36 AM To dfdl-wg(a)gridforum.org cc Subject [dfdl-wg] Microsoft Biztalk Flat File Extensions Microsoft has a completely proprietary but otherwise DFDL-like thing in its bag of tricks too: see http://www.winterdom.com/dev/bts/BTSFFSchemaTut2.html

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Microsoft Biztalk Flat File Extensions
by mike.beckerle＠ascentialsoftware.com 28 Jan '05

28 Jan '05

Microsoft has a completely proprietary but otherwise DFDL-like thing in its bag of tricks too: see http://www.winterdom.com/dev/bts/BTSFFSchemaTut2.html <http://www.winterdom.com/dev/bts/BTSFFSchemaTut2.html>

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new specs from w3c
by mike.beckerle＠ascentialsoftware.com 26 Jan '05

26 Jan '05

This info FYI. We will be asked to position DFDL vis a vis XML optimized via XOP for example. I don't think this changes anything. These are again "prescriptive" data representation schemes. DFDL is descriptive. But it is addressing some of the "XML is too bloated and slow" concerns bit by bit. Also, I think XOP is only efficient if used to package large binary objects like images and such. If you had data with lots of small fields in it then XOP doesn't help. ...mikeb cg20W3C Specs for "Faster, Efficient" Web Services Section: 04. Application Development and Platforms The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C) yesterday issued three recommended web services specifications, designed to efficiently package and transmit binary data included in, or referenced in, SOAP 1.2. The group has released XML-binary Optimized Packaging (XOP), SOAP Message Transmission Optimization Mechanism (MTOM) and Resource Representation SOAP Header Block (RRSHB). In a statement, the W3C said the specifications means web services "just became faster and more usable." Michael Curry Ascential SOA Product Marketing O: 508-599-7157 M: 508-904-7384 <http://www.ascential.com/> http://www.ascential.com

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