Keisuke, I read your .ppt sent to OGSA/CDDLM, I don't think there is a problem since I don't seen anything restricting a job document to be in an AA. The concern I had that caused me to comment was a 'best practices' concern that perhaps is best address in OGSA and does not need to be addressed in the ACS spec. It may need to involve other building off our spec, and adding constraints on what should be in certain AAs. My simple concern was that the job doc that starts the ball rolling should be encapsulated in something with a version number, and protected against undesired modification via signature, much like an AA can do. As you pointed out, we are not preventing this, so the comment can be addressed elsewhere. I agree, I think that for the most part we don't put restrictions on what content can go in the AA, and that is reflected in 3.1.1. I also agree, it is reflected in 3.1.4 that job "instance" should NOT be maintained. I think this is well stated. We should perhaps clarify that this does not mean that JSDL is excluded from an AA. To me job "instance" means any dynamic state concerned with an executing job, and this does not restrict the ability for a job managing entity to obtain JSDL from an AA, correct? Food for thought: Since AA's can have external references, there is nothing stopping a "root" AA from containing nothing but a JSDL doc, and a reference to the main content AA. If this type of job submittal format was optionally allowed by OGSA, then an EPR of a "root" AA could be submitted to the job managing entity to kick off a job, not just a JSDL doc. This would mean that the actual execution instruction is conveniently archived in the repository with a version and signature. Pete. -----Original Message----- From: owner-acs-wg@ggf.org [mailto:owner-acs-wg@ggf.org] On Behalf Of Keisuke Fukui Sent: Friday, October 14, 2005 1:44 AM To: Ziu, Peter Cc: acs-wg@ggf.org Subject: Re: [acs-wg] RE: Your comments on the draft spec. Pete, Glad to hear that you doing fine and hope to see you. I will prepare myself for the discussion toward next step. Ziu, Peter wrote:
In the section "3.1.4 Relationship between AA and Job" (Page 14), you left the comment "D10" below: Perhaps we could say a unit of "configuration management"
We didn't see problem here in the review at GGF15. Can you elaborate on this a bit more?
I think the above statement did not outline a problem in the doc that needed fixing, but rather an opportunity to make the distinction between sofware components, configuration and runtime parameters/contraints[jsdl], and that these distinct components could be concidered one configuration mananaged package within the AA.
I come to understand a part of your point in the original description: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- An AA can be used to create a job, i.e. a unit of task, in the grid system. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- However, we have a general description of AA, a few pages before, in section "3.1.1 Application Archive and Repository" as below: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Such information may include, but not limited to, the application executable code, configuration data necessary for initial deployment of the application and the deployment descriptor documents. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- This clearly states that not only the software components, but also any data specific to the software can be stored. Then, we came here to in "3.1.4 Relationship between AA and Job", drilling down to the advanced topic. As such, the description here is focusing the relationship to Job instance of AA instance. An single AA should be able to be reused to instantiate multiple jobs. So the relationship between them should be maintained by Job Managing entity in the system. I explained this in the slides named "acs_GGF15-F2F-EMS-draft.ppt" attached to my message in ogsa-wg ML on Oct 12 in response to Dejan of CDDLM. It would be better if we could have simple and complete statement in one place. I think the current text is my best shot, though I admit they may give the readers somewhat dispersed and complex impression. In summary, I believe that the original text doesn't conflict your vision. Please correct me if I'm still besides the point.
package within the AA. (a managed unit w/ version) This is important for automated repeatability. This relates to some comments that Andrew Grimshaw had at the Sunnyvale face to face, that one can take a software unit, supply different parameters, and in essence wind up with a "new piece of software and function". At the time, to me it seemed important to capture a version and place for this new piece of software. So by treating job as part of AA content, this is possible. In this way, to run a job, one could pass to the "job manager" the EPR to an AA. I am not sure I can defend myself properly on this position, it seems on the surface plausible, but not mandetory. It seems more highly organized than having the JDSL somewhere out there, but also the idea seems to not be required in all use cases. Hope this helps to clarify :-)
With respect to replication, what is written in 4.5 is fine. I think we should perhaps leave things to master/slave for now to be able to accomplish a version 1.0. My comments a few meetings ago about replication GUIDs are really only a concern in bi-direction replication, so we are ok for now. There are too many open GGF issues right now with repect to naming, which would be a key component of any replication scheme, and also, the orep-wg's inactivity (last time a looked [a few months ago]). I think what is written is excellent for now.
Thanks! I've been trying to keep our first specification simple, as well as very combinable with other specifications or technologies, to go along with SOA thought. Those replication topics are among them in my mind. ACS should be a pluggable service component in the grid systems. I hope once we finish the base spec out, then we can continue building another one on top of that. -Keisuke